13 April 2002, 17:31
rockhead
Never shot a moose b4-however have shot more than a few elk past 400 with the 340. It worked just fine.
So have it and get on the hill.
"GET TO THE HILL"
Dog
I have only killed one moose, and it was standing broadside at 165 paces before it died. But I have hunted moose for four seasons, and seen lots of them. I saw none, zero, nada, that if they were 400 yards away, would not have allowed for a sneak a crawl, or a walkup to shorter distances.
If a person is disabled and confined to a wheel chair, or a fourwheeler, as a friend of mine is, perhaps a 400 yarder is needed. Otherwise, a 300 win mag or equal will do everything. That is what my moose guiding friend carries, and he swears by it. I have seen him offhand beer cans at 100 yards, standing, and hit spent shot shells at half his shots.. Doubt he would shoot so well with too big a boomer....
Good thing about this forum, is you get lots of input and sometimes even your questions answered, usually by accident.
I think a 340 Weatherby is overkill for moose, but I am just a 9.3X74 type of wimp.
All of them have shot well under an inch with no problem! My first tube would do under.75" for 5 shots day in and day out. To me this is one accurate round. IMO
I have also had these cut without the free-bore for what that is worth.
My "smiths" name is Dan Dowling of Palisades, Co. His nubmer is 970-434-0525, give him a call, he's a great fella. Call him M-F between 8 am and noon.
For me it would be beyond a doubt the way to go.
Now about overkill I am not about to get into that discussion. That whole concept just doesn't make any sense to me. I've used my 340's for tons of yotes and chucks,lopes,deer, elk, bear etc. They all died just fine-dead is dead to me.
Great round, am just amazed the world doesn't take to it more!?
"GET TO THE HILL"
Dog
Brad
How can you even begin to compare the 9.3X74R with a 340 Weatherby. To do so shows great ignorance. The 9.3X74R is a deer and boar cartridge. It says so right in "Cartridges of the World". This guy is going after Moose, which if you haven't noticed are a bit bigger than you average red stag!
The 340 is an excellent high performance modern magnum. I would recommend the 338 Lapua if you want a 33 bore, but hte Weatherby will work fine. At those ranges bullet design becomes a little less critical as impact energies are more inline with what a nonpartitioned bullet can withstand. That said I would use a Swift A-Frame or Nosler Partition since you never know at what range Mr. Bullwinkle will appear.
Todd E
I you're gonna shoot a moose at 400 plus yards you'd be hard pressed to find a better cartridge than the .340 Weatherby.
Keep in mind, though, the .340 is a damn hard kicker (the sharpest kicker I've ever shot), especially if it's in one of Roys crooked assed stock. Kinda hard to shoot accurately if you're the least bit recoil sensitive.
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The older I get the better I was.
I'd also be very happy with my .300 Winchester for a 400 yard moose shot. I'd wait for him to turn broadside, then I'd place a 180 gr. Nosler Partition right behind his shoulder through the lungs. Moose are not that hard to kill if you can shoot and if you employ a good bullet. I don't belieeve that the specific caliber is all that critical.
AD
All depends on where you hunt, I guess. My hunting partner killed a moose two years ago, and it was perhaps 20 paces away. He has shot moose out to about 150 yards. The first moose I ever shot (I was very inexperienced then) was 300 yards away, and downhill. Two 230-grain FS bullets hit too high above the lungs, and the third broke both legs dropping it. Now that I have learned "a little" I get closer, unless the moose is walking away from me.
What kind of scope do you plan to use with that 400-yard rifle? Will you hunt moose around bears? If so, you may want to set the scope to it's lowest power when you walk through the brush.
I have shot moose as close as 100 yards, but most around 200. The average moose shot is within 150 yards for most hunters around here. It would be the same way for me, but I watch a large field where moose congregate, and the center of the field is about 200 yards away.
The most popular cartridges in Alaska are the .30-06, .300WM, and .338WM, and far behind the rest of cartridges used in the Lower-48.
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Sinner, saved by God's unfailing grace!
To answer the question, I'd use the scope I have on my current .300 Winchester - a 3.5-10X Leica. I shot a gemsbok in Namibia (I used a jacket over a rock on top of a cliff for a rest as well as a tight sling) at right at 400 yards last year. Gemsbok are smaller than moose........
AD
How can you even begin to compare the 9.3X74R with a 340 Weatherby. To do so shows great ignorance. The 9.3X74R is a deer and boar cartridge. It says so right in "Cartridges of the World". This guy is going after Moose, which if you haven't noticed are a bit bigger than you average red stag!
And you, Todd E, are a blowhard. tomorrow, I shall no longer be ignorant, but I fear you will still be blowing smoke. Apology to Sir winston for that one.
In your retort, you make three false statements>
1. I did not and do not compare a 9.3X74R to a 340 Weatherbeater. I admit to being a 9.3X74R wimp. In response to the question seeking advice for a 400 yard moose rifle, I suggest a 300 win mag.
2. I recommend a 300 win mag for a 400 yard moose rifle over a 340 Weatherby because of my experience that people will shoot more wiht a 300, and will learn to shoot it well.
3. I recommend against a 400 yard cannon unless physical limitations make stalking impossible.. This is an opinion of mine. long range shooting is best for inanimate object like targets, or nooption species like antelope or sheep. The big old dumb moose is not a no-option stalking species.
As to being ignorant, I suggest you reread Cartridges of the World, or maybe mine is too old. HTe eigth edition, 1997, states that the 9.3X74R gained a good reputation in Africa against most game, including elephant. It is also stated as adequate for any north american big game.
Your reference to a quote of "deer and boar" either shows that my COTW is not like yours, or that you are blowing smoke where there is no sunlight.
but, all these aside, I do appreciate you pointing out that you like 340 weatherby. Have you used one on moose? have you shot one? I can state that I have done one of the two above, and because of that, I do not care to do the other.
Try a dozen range test shots in different postions, and then decide whether you want a 340 or a 338 or a 300. Or do like I did, and try a 9.3 and learn to stalk.
Smallfry,
What kinda rifle have you got that is chambered in 9.3X74R? It is pretty obvious from reading between the lines what Merkelmeisters is (I assume a Merkel 140 or single shot stalker).
Merkelmeister,
I have not shot a 340 Weatherby Mag. I have shot a 300 Weatherby Mag. It could not be relied upon to dispatch elk at 619 yards (I remember the range correctly I could be off a few yards, but the shot was over 600). I have shot elk with a 416 Rigby and 338 Lapua at ranges to 650 yards. Most impressive. I assume the Weatherby will be the approximate equivalent of the Lapua.
What truly intrigues me is how upset you became because of a quote (or misquote) from some meaningless book! Relax it is only a book. What it says means nothing in the field. If I am going to stalk things I will just use a 22LR in a Browning Buckmaster! I just need to stalk to within about 30 feet.
Todd E
Bull Elk on the other hand take more killing and that is just plain fact. I have heard and read reports of good hit bulls going a long way before giving up the ghost. A lot of these were shoulder shot elk, which according to most outfitters is a NO NO. I suppose that is why so many hunters after a couple of elk hunts, choose to get themselves a 338 mag. to allow for that spirited advisary.
I have considered the 338 win mag in a Ruger M77. what is accuracy out of these? (anyone have one?) but trajectory is a little flatter. unless I can load it a little hotter than regular factory ammo. federal premium high power does it.
I plan on scoping it with a leupold 3.5-10 varX III.
moose hunting will be in northern Maine (if I get lucky to be drawn for the permit) terrain is very thick wooded areas. you could be within a moose by 20-30 yards and would not even know it is there. but we will stick to logging roads with clear cuts.
in the clear cuts I could easily take an 800+ yard shot but I do have my limitations. my practicing maximizes at 400 yards at our local range.
I didn't see that! 340 Wby? 338 Win Mag? I'd use a carbine in 308 Win/30-06 or 350 Rem Mag/35 Whelen.. as was pointed out, you can always get closer. To me, I'd never think of those rounds in the great state of Maine... they just seem, well, out of place! Guess I've got more tradition in me than I realize!
Seriously, this is all fun and games... use what YOU like... why not the 458 Win?
BA
my 458 win with a 300gr barnesX would work wonders at 2700ft/s but I am having a problem getting accuracy with this small bullet. but if I can get it to perform....this will shoot as flat as a 338 win. but I would like to have a 340 or other flat shooter "just because".
by the way....has anyone ever tried the 180gr nosler Ballistic tip in the 340? accuracy?loads?
.338 Lapua
.330 Dakota (a little faster that the.338WM)
.338 RUM
.340 Wby.
.338-378 (a little faster than most .33's).
.338 (8.59) Lazzeroni Titan (a little faster than most .33's).
Trajectories from factoy loads:
.338WM
250-grain Fed. HE at 2,800 fps = +1.8" at 100 yards, and -22.5" at 400 yards. With standard factory ammo, bullet drop should be a couple of inches more.
.33 Titan
A 250-grain La. bullet at 3,150 fps (+1.2" at 100 yards) should only drop to -16.2" at 400 yards
.340
.338RUM
Bullet drop (250-gr. at 2960 fps) should drop to about -20" at 400 yards.
.338-378
Is very capable of launching 250-grain bullets faster than 3,000 fps, and bullet drop should be comparable to the Titan.
[This message has been edited by Ray, Alaska (edited 04-14-2002).]
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Sinner, saved by God's unfailing grace!
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"Hey, I wanna turn in Billy, man. He sold me the s**t that wouldn't get a fly high!"
I have considered the 338 win mag in a Ruger M77. what is accuracy out of these? (anyone have one?) but trajectory is a little flatter. unless I can load it a little hotter than regular factory ammo. federal premium high power does it.
I plan on scoping it with a leupold 3.5-10 varX III.
moose hunting will be in northern Maine (if I get lucky to be drawn for the permit) terrain is very thick wooded areas. you could be within a moose by 20-30 yards and would not even know it is there. but we will stick to logging roads with clear cuts.
in the clear cuts I could easily take an 800+ yard shot but I do have my limitations. my practicing maximizes at 400 yards at our local range.
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What kind of loads are you using in that 9.3X74R chambered Ruger No1? With that strong action you could easily beat the 338 Win Mag in the energy department. Heck you should be able to get an honsest 2500 -2550 fps with a 320 grain Woodleigh. Should be no problem getting 2750 fps with a 250 grainer.
With that performance you ain't got a 9.3X74R as God intended it no more. You have a weapon that at reasonable ranges walks all over the 33 bores mentioned on this thread. The reason being that you are essentially shooting a 375 H&H!
Todd E
Loading the case up to higher velocity is not loading it to something else! The 9.3X74R is loaded to no existing SAAMI specifications so I do not know what the factory load pressure is. This cartridge has been historically a double barrel number so it has been loaded light. In factory form it essentially duplicates 9.3X63 Mauser ballistics, but at pressures suitable for a double rifle.
In my double I load it with 63.5 grains of IMR 4350. No problems with that load. I basically manage to duplicate Norma factory ballistics, which are better published numbers than RWS. I assume you meant IMR 4350 by the way instead of a nonexistent IMR4850.
I was only pointing out that with your Ruger No1 you could get more from this cartridge.
Todd E
There seems to be alot of contradictions to what you are saying. Such as... That you cant even compare a 9.3X74R to a 340, yet when loading up a 9.3 you stated that you have a cartridge that walks all over any 33 bores mentioned on this thread at reasoniable range.
Secondly you had said that when loaded up... the 9.3 you "aint got a 9.3X74R as god intended no more" which was kinda my point (without the god part) as to why I generaly dont load up cartridges yet you said that "Loading the case up to higher velocity is not loading it to something else!" am I missing something?
Now the clincher to the whole hunting story is that you now claim you own one... which if you actualy do... you must not hunt big game very much with it... or not at all. Or you are not very observant. I do believe that virtually every night you and your copy of "cartridges of the world" go on little hunting adventures before bed time, which would explain alot of your posts.
Take care
I think my rifle is accurate enough, because I usually hit moose exactly where I aim from a rest (tree branch, or a made-up rest from branches). At the range from a cold barrel, I can get two 230-grain FS bullets to print within 1/2" at 100 yards, but what I try to do instead of trying too hard for extra accuracy, is to aim as fast as possible and to fire two or three shots from the bench. If two or three shots from a clean and cold barrel strike somewhere around 2" at 100 yards, my rifle is ready for moose and bear hunting.
The 9.3X74R as God intended it ain't what you got big boy. You have a modern rifle suitable for 60,000 psi breech pressures.
The 9.3X74R was designed to provide the ballistic performance of a 9.3X63 Mauser which was loaded to around 54,000 psi. The 9.3X74R achieves these ballistics at about 36,000 psi.
Now are you following me so far. You can load up the 9.3X74 R (which has about the same case capacity as a 338 Win Mag) to achieve very close to 375 H&H factory loaded ballistics. This is because the 9.3X74R has a better expansion ratio than the 375 (not much though).
Still following me. Now you can load your 9.3X74R up to 50,000 psi and run with the 375 H&H simply because you have a Ruger No1. You have a larger bullet with more than ample power so you are better off than the 33 bores. You will have a 200 - 250 fps advantage over a double rifle safe load (36,000 psi).
I would not hesitate to use my 9.3x74R on moose. I reread my COTW and it says the 9.3X74R would work just fine on all NA game at short to moderate ranges. My 9.3X74R is a SXS double rifle however so I am just slightly short of a 375 Flange Magnum in ballistics. Therefore I am a bit short of a 340 Weatherby Mag, particularly at 400 yards!
Aren't you the college student that has all those custom big bore and double rifles in Nitro Express chamberings? If so I wish I had your money now let alone when I was a starving college student.
Todd E
I have shot the 180's they are in the guns I've worked with very accurate! 1/4" to 3/4" 3 shooters being the norm.
They would run 3300 in a 23" Schneider tube with no problem. I would have to look at my notes but I am quite sure I ran 3400 as well.
I used R22- that load was wonderful on chucks/p.dogs and yotes. Think we shot a lope or two with it also and it certainly will make the fur fly. Chucks really do acrobatics with em as well!! I especially love the Olga Korbit chucks-great back flips!
For a pure hunting load if I was considering the Noz BT I would really prefer the 200 over the 180. We've shot a fair number of der/elk and bears with em and they work just fine.
Good luck with your decision.
"GET TO THE HILL"
Dog