26 June 2011, 02:54
Aaron NeilsonYoung/Immature Lions!
Keep shootin em, and we're gonna lose em! It's just that simple, and not much more can be said about it.
My goal is to eliminate the shooting of young lions, and work towards the education of us all. The hunting community, and the PH community must adhere to more stringent lion management practices, as we have discussed numerous times here now.
Mike - If ignoring this huge conservation necessity as it pertains to the lion, and instead, insist that I am simply trying to be offensive, makes you feel better, then carry on! Instead, how about this. Why don't we ALL as a collective unit, work together to accomplish a conservation goal that would be the first of its kind in the African hunting world? Along the way, maybe we can do some good for the rest of the African Wildlife too!
On the other hand, if you can explain to me the conservation benefits that I am missing, that are to be gained from the shooting of young/immature lions, I'm all ears?
26 June 2011, 05:50
gerrybafter all of this discussion it seems like everyone should read what the science says. these guys will testify for or against us and thats who will be heard. they have put it in black and white and made it clear if we(hunters) keep shooting young lions they will have no choice but to testify against us.Its just that simple.I am not sure why hunters are not getting on the band wagon and pitching in.
26 June 2011, 07:18
shootawayquote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
I don't blame the PH mostly because of hard economic times.The same for the hunter in that his resources may be limited and it's his first time and goes until the last days and sees just this somewhat young lion.If the hunter has all kinds of money then I feel it is an esier task of letting a younger one go.I am not sure about the future of the lion hunting being jeopardized by shooting a young one,could be just don't know enough.I am pretty sure that no one wants to shoot a young male.If the safari companies close down because of lack of business then you can bet no one will be hunting lions aside from the poachers.
26 June 2011, 17:19
Aaron Neilsonquote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
quote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
I don't blame the PH mostly because of hard economic times.The same for the hunter in that his resources may be limited and it's his first time and goes until the last days and sees just this somewhat young lion.If the hunter has all kinds of money then I feel it is an esier task of letting a younger one go.I am not sure about the future of the lion hunting being jeopardized by shooting a young one,could be just don't know enough.I am pretty sure that no one wants to shoot a young male.If the safari companies close down because of lack of business then you can bet no one will be hunting lions aside from the poachers.
Shootaway - I'm not totally sure what you're saying here? I know the financial burden on the PH/outfitter can sometimes be a factor, but they cannot let that factor dictate good management practices. In the long-run that's just cutting their own throats.
26 June 2011, 18:10
shootawayYou are probably right,Aaron.Lions should be chosen the same way we choose a hard boss buffalo but i don't think it should be witten as a law.
quote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
You are probably right,Aaron.Lions should be chosen the same way we choose a hard boss buffalo.
26 June 2011, 19:23
Aaron Neilsonquote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
You are probably right,Aaron.Lions should be chosen the same way we choose a hard boss buffalo but i don't think it should be witten as a law.
Shootaway - You sir hit the nail on the head! I don't "think or want" it written as law either. However, it has come to that in Tanzania, and will likely come to that elsewhere, for one simple reason. Many still involved in the African Hunting community have proved unable to regulate themselves (ie - recent lions shot in Zim). So instead, others continue to pressure African govts to implement new laws, at the same time, they are pressuring CITES to uplist the lion, and the ESA to uplist lion as well.
I have said this many times now, and its not gonna change. Until we start regulating proper lion hunting/management practices ourselves, others are gonna try and do it for us. That to me is extremely unfortunate, but its also factual!
26 June 2011, 21:11
shootawayA very good point.There is nothing better than the feeling I get when I take a good trophy-not only in terms of being able to show it off but knowing that I've done my part in conservation.
27 June 2011, 03:27
Aaron Neilsonquote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
A very good point.There is nothing better than the feeling I get when I take a good trophy-not only in terms of being able to show it off but knowing that I've done my part in conservation.
Yes sir, I just hope more folks will start to follow your example!
10 July 2011, 23:00
465H&Hquote:
Originally posted by Aaron Neilson:
quote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
You are probably right,Aaron.Lions should be chosen the same way we choose a hard boss buffalo but i don't think it should be witten as a law.
Shootaway - You sir hit the nail on the head! I don't "think or want" it written as law either. However, it has come to that in Tanzania, and will likely come to that elsewhere, for one simple reason. Many still involved in the African Hunting community have proved unable to regulate themselves (ie - recent lions shot in Zim). So instead, others continue to pressure African govts to implement new laws, at the same time, they are pressuring CITES to uplist the lion, and the ESA to uplist lion as well.
I have said this many times now, and its not gonna change. Until we start regulating proper lion hunting/management practices ourselves, others are gonna try and do it for us. That to me is extremely unfortunate, but its also factual!
Aaron,
It may take more restrictive lion harvest laws to satisfy CITES and the USF&WS that sufficient laws exist to assure that lion survival rates remain high enough to prevent Cites listing..
465H&H