Re: Winchester Expands Winchester Short Magnum Li

14 October 2004, 10:21

BTT for Con.

George

07 October 2004, 03:12

<eldeguello>

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Hey dan, check out Midway's web site. They are already listing a 200gr .323 Nosler Accubond

"COMING SOON"!!!

21 October 2004, 18:20

Brad

POP, what does an 8mm 200 grainer at 2,900 fps do better than a .308 200 grainer at 2,850 fps?

21 October 2004, 16:41

POP

Fellas. There is nothing wrong with the 8mm...especially when they will introduce new bullets for it. I would hunt just about anything with a 200 gr Swift A-frame 8mm at 2900 fps.

21 October 2004, 19:02

Mauserkid

If they came out with the 338 or the 35, there would be no market for a 325. This way they sell a bunch of every thing... My guess would be the 35 next, followed by the 338. This should insure the most sales.

I would have waited for the eight my self anyhow....

Cant wait to see the dies hit the market..

Come on eight!

21 October 2004, 17:53

bajabill

thanks Dutch

that is a good page. I dont have much, or any, practical experience with brass material properties, so I try not to make assumptions based on my experience with aluminums. That study was a pretty extensive one, with the nonlinear material properties. Also, the hoop load paths and support from the chamber wall minimized much of the impact of stress risers eluded to in the above posts. I have thought of atempting a much less sufisticated model of a cartridge, but that would be too much mixing of my job and hobby.

21 October 2004, 19:12

AnotherAZWriter

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I have also blasted thousands of animals but that has little or nothing to do with rifle facts. In fact it has nothing to do with it.

Hey, varmints don't count!

George

Actually, George, show me a good varmint hunter and I will show you a guy who is death in the field.

John,
I hunt varmints every year in Wyoming, too. I was ragging Savage99 on his claim of having shot 'thousands of animals'.

George

Hey, I have to defend my varmint hunting buddies...

21 October 2004, 14:25

Wstrnhuntr

All this fuss over a little insignificant copper belt. Who cares?

Apparently some people feel threatened by the WSM line, time to grow up and accept the facts. They arent going away.

21 October 2004, 23:55

wildcat junkie

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POP, what does an 8mm 200 grainer at 2,900 fps do better than a .308 200 grainer at 2,850 fps?

Generate 3,734fp of muzzle energy.

22 October 2004, 04:06

Wstrnhuntr

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POP, what does an 8mm 200 grainer at 2,900 fps do better than a .308 200 grainer at 2,850 fps?

Very little if anything, but the same can be said about the 200 gn 308 vs a 175 gn 7mm @ about the same velocity. So by that logic the introduction of the 7mm rm was folly too.

Like Atkinson has said, there are a great number of rounds that basically accomplish the same thing. Use what you like and enjoy it.

22 October 2004, 03:23

Brad

You're qoting energy figures? No disrespect, but give me a break! That .015" difference really shows up as a powerful difference on game, huh?

23 October 2004, 05:16

<9.3x62>

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Also, anything under .308" out-sells anything over .308" by another 20 to 1...

Well this fact alone would seem to be motivation enough for Olin to go 323 instead of 338 - closer to the hotter selling bores. Perhaps this and the Euro/Africa market swayed them.

Why not 35? IMHO, we already have the 358 and 350 RM (SA), plus that fact that 35 caliber rounds have only a small following. Besides, Americans who buy stuff with the word "magnum" attached seem to prefer high velocity and laser-like trajectories, a 35 WSM would not be that.

Winchester pulled off the 264 WM even in the shadow of the equally capable 270. While not a smashing success, the 264 has done reasonably well. Perhaps avoiding the dreaded 6.5mm label made all the difference.

23 October 2004, 03:18

Brad

Regardless Junkie, I'm all for you having and shooting whatever you please... really! I do suspect based on your comment's however that your interest is more, er, academic/handloading in nature.

23 October 2004, 03:08

Brad

Junkie, as you might know the 270 (.277") is a true 7mm and the 270 WSM outsells the 7mm WSM by 20 to 1. And since the 270 WSM was on the scene first I agree

there never was a need for a 7mm WSM.

Also, anything under .308" out-sells anything over .308" by another 20 to 1 and the Olin boys have fewer chances to capture any market over 30 cal, hence my objection to their real-world (vs. mental gymnastic's) brain-fart by introducing an 8mm but then, hey, that would bring us back to reality and the topic at hand.

One guess is they're throwing a bone to the European market...

22 October 2004, 17:34

wildcat junkie

Quote:

You're qoting energy figures? No disrespect, but give me a break! That .015" difference really shows up as a powerful difference on game, huh?

Then the same can be said for the .338 compared to .323, .015".

Then there is the .243 compared to .224, .019".

.257 compared to .243, .014".

.264 compared to .257, .007"

.277 compared to .264, .013"

.284 compared to .277, .007"

.308 compared to .284, .024"

.358 compared to .338, .020" etc. etc.

Besides, a better comparison would be a 200gr .308 compared to a 220gr .323 @ a similar velocity, that is the real world difference. The difference in a 200gr .308 compared to a 200gr .323 of similar construction would be more in the neighborhood of 150-200fps @ similar pressure from the same sized case. That is a sizable difference, about like the difference between a .300 Win and the "06".

If Winchester had not pandered to the American preferance to "familiar" calibers we wouldn't have the rediculous .270 WSM that does nothing that the 7mm WSM does except limit bullet choices.

A much better "trio" would have been 7mm WSM (.284) 8mm WSM (.323) and 9mm WSM (.358). Then we would have had a much broader realm of capabilities without the "overlap".