Mild medium for a stubby barrel?

15 June 2002, 10:26

John Frazer

Which round would you choose for efficiency with a big, heavy bullet in a shorter (21" barrel or less), relatively light, rifle for hunting elk, moose, bear, big deer, etc. in the "black timber" or "shintangle" or whatever term you prefer in your area?

.338-06?
.358 Win.?
.350 Rem. Mag.?
.35 Whelen?

Something else?

15 June 2002, 10:48

Paul H

358 win!

15 June 2002, 11:02

BER007

John Frazer,

9.3X62 or all .338 Family (.338 Win mag,...)

15 June 2002, 13:08

<Don Martin29>

While I favor the .358 Win I really just fell into it years ago and it has been so successful that it's now my favorite. But it's a rare item and not easily found today.

I would start with the rifle that you like and then pick the cartridge. There are .338's, .350's, .375 Wins, .44's and .45's and even a .480 Ruger.

If I did not have .358 Winchesters I would get a .35 Whelan and shorten it.

A friend has a JC Higgins M-51 that he sent out to be made into a .450 Marlin.

Just some ideas.

15 June 2002, 14:26

fredj338

The larger bores seem to loose less veocity when you shorten bbls. I would think a 35. whelen or 9.3x62 in a nice Mannlicher carbine, would be a great woods rifle.

15 June 2002, 14:51

KurtC

For non-magnum cartridges: the larger the bore, the shorter the barrel can be without much velocity loss. The barrel will have enough volume for the powder to burn.
The .358 Win is probably one of the most efficient burning cartridges ever designed, but only makes sense in a short action rifle. If your action is standard length, than the 9.3x62 is an excellent choice for short barrels. The Sako Mannlichers have 19" barrels, the CZ550 and Brno 98 are 20" and the full stock Zoli's are 21"

15 June 2002, 15:39

<Fireplug>

The .350 Remington Magnum is my choice. The magnum handles the heavier bullets better than the smaller cased rounds, and you do not move to the larger calibers for light low SD bullets. The .350 has enough case capacity yet still fits in a short action to help keep the rifle short and light. You can not do better without going to a wildcat.

Fireplug

16 June 2002, 02:43

<Mark C. Kimmell>

I use a 15" 35 Whelen in a T/C Encore handgun for elk hunting. I chronographed my Hornady 250gr. round nose at 2100fps. The Hornady reloading book claims 2400fps. in a rifle barrel. Only 300fps. difference. I don"t think that cow elk knew the difference in 300fps. that I used this gun on 6yrs. ago. Mark [Wink]

16 June 2002, 02:55

Dr. Lou

I would choose the .358 Winnie. It will do everything you need it to do out to 250 yds

Dr. Lou

16 June 2002, 04:22

<eldeguello>

.358 Win., no question but what!!!

16 June 2002, 08:17

<leo>

Either .358 winnie or 9.3x57 mauser.

16 June 2002, 12:47

HunterJim

I would use my .376 Steyr ProHunter; with its 20" barrel it is under 40" long. Factory load is a 270 grain Hornady Interlock at about 2,500 fps.

jim dodd

17 June 2002, 07:04

Fritz Kraut

quote:
Originally posted by John Frazer:
Which round would you choose for efficiency with a big, heavy bullet in a shorter (21" barrel or less), relatively light, rifle for hunting elk, moose, bear, big deer, etc. in the "black timber" or "shintangle" or whatever term you prefer in your area?

.338-06?
.358 Win.?
.350 Rem. Mag.?
.35 Whelen?

Something else?

From my european point of view, I would suggest a 9,3x57 or a 8x57IS. Go with Norma or RWS loads, as american ammo for the 8x57IS is too weak - or load your own.

Best regards,

Fritz

18 June 2002, 16:49

elmo

.376 Steyr might be just the ticket for you.

That said, a nice clean accurate Savage 99 in .358 Win would be mighty nice too!

Elmo

18 June 2002, 18:15

N E 450 No2

If you want easy to find ammo and componets 35WHELEN. If you do not mind having to order your ammo or componets and like the exotic get a 9.3x62. Either ctg. is very effective and easy on the shoulder.

18 June 2002, 19:44

aHunter

i would ( and have ) chosen a chambering which is a little short on case capacity. This necessitates powdwers, which are not the slowest.

My recommendations: 7x57, .308, 8x75IS, 9.3x62.

Have fun! Hermann

19 June 2002, 04:43

<Don Martin29>

It's about time Ruger made another run of .358 Winchesters. Lets contact them and get something going. There is a Ruger forum at www.rugerforum.com.

USARC lists the .358 Win in it's custom chamberings now so there is hope.

19 June 2002, 05:19

<JOHAN>

I would have picked 9,3X62, 9,3X57 or any of the 338's. 35 cal? Thank you but I'll think I pass that one.

/ JOHAN

19 June 2002, 06:58

<Mats>

9.3x57 is a nice little round... With faster powders it's really quiet too, even from a short barrel. But seeing how you yanks never discovered the .366" bore, maybe a .358 Win would be about the same... Plus the benefit of being able to use cheap handgun bullets for practise and short-range varminting.

-- Mats

19 June 2002, 08:27

carcano91

The old - and once upon a time, in Africa, justly popular - 9,5 x 57 Mannlicher seems netly superior to the 9,3 x 57 Mauser. Alas, nobody loads it anymore... except Romey and Kynamco.

Regards,
Carcano

19 June 2002, 08:43

Nickudu

You did say a "mild medium". The .358 will give you all you want while burning ALL it's powder in a 21" barrel. The .350 Rem is also fine but I prefer at least a 22" tube for it, like in the Remington "Classic" rifle. Both are highly underated killers with surprising ranging ability, when needed.

19 June 2002, 11:57

<JimF>

Here's an idea for a short, light, fairly mild package...

338-08. It's a wildcat, but the excellent .358 might as well be due to poor ammo choices and availability and no current factory chamberings that I know of.

Mine is a short action Rem. 700, 21" bbl. in a kevlar stock. Weight is 5 3/4 lbs with a 2X7 Leo. on board.

Ballistics are ~~ 180/2700-2760, 200/2665, 225/2400. Very efficient cartridge that gives similar trajectory and recoil to a good factory 30-06 but in a shorter lighter gun. (And a nice fat bullet for 'brer bear or 'brer elk)

Jim

20 June 2002, 06:55

<JOHAN>

MATS

You forgot to tell the yanks that the 35 has poor sd and bc compared to the 9,3 [Big Grin]

All good things does not come from USA [Big Grin]

/JOHAN

20 June 2002, 11:30

MacD37

Just get a Ruger No1 with a full 26" barrel in 7mm rem mag, 300 win mag, or 338 Win Mag, and still have a shorter over all length rifle! Or you can just get one of those "UGLY" little 376 Steyrs that Jim uses! [Roll Eyes]

20 June 2002, 12:14

Rob1SG

I'll take the 338-06 it will do everything the Whelan will do and then some. SD of 338 bullets is hard to beat and the 338-06 drives them fast enough to take care of anything in North America. Factory ammo is available from Weatherby in 210 Nosler Partition.

23 June 2002, 16:11

<Pabearman>

I never realized that there were so amny 358 Win lovers out there. I had one years ago in a Savage M99. Four years ago I had one built on a Ruger M77 All-Weather I had purchased in 308 Win. Very light stock, I replaced the 30 cal bbl with a 35 cal Shilen bbl in the same 20" light conture. Placed a 1.75-5X Burris compact, matte finish scope. It's right about 6lbs. The only problem comes with bench shooting potent 225gr rounds. It can be a little hard on the shoulder after 10 rounds or so, but very accurate and leathal on Pa black bear or whitetail at the long distances of the northern Pa hunting(15-40yds).
p.s. what ever you buy or build, get what you want, not because we all like them.I've owned alot of guns in my life, almost everyone of them shot well, some great, not all were what I wanted.

25 June 2002, 09:14

Paul B

My vote goes for the .358 Win. A most underrated cartridge. [Smile]

Paul B.

25 June 2002, 15:32

<Don Martin29>

Pabearman,

Try the 180 Speer FN in the .358 Win. for deer and bear. The recoil is a lot less, it's a very accurate bullet and the effect on game is spectacular. They just fall down and stay there with this load.

I have hunted in Western Pa and my hunting buddy is from Grove City. We both hunt with .358 Wins most of the time.

06 July 2002, 08:22

JohnB

John,
Recently I had a Ruger M77RSI (Mannlicher stock) re-barreled to .338-06 with a Shilen 18.5in barrel. I haven't had a chance to shoot it yet (it is getting re-finished), but the gunsmith did and reports "not bad recoil and great performance". I wanted a short and manuverable tool for the thick stuff here in Southeast Alaska. I think this will fill the bill. With all the support by the aficioandos of the .338-06 I thought this would be a great set up for a short and effective firearm.
JB