Here's a quote from Norma's 2008 catalog:

quote:

NEW NORMA MAGNUMS
In all probability, we will continue extending the Norma family with
three new calibers: 300, 338 and 375 Norma Magnum.
The latest trend in big game cartridges is short, fat, belt-less magnum
cases. The new Norma Magnums will be based on the 416 Rigby but
with a longer case than most of the new American “Short Magnumsâ€.
As a consequence, the new Norma Magnums will have higher velocities
and energy than the American competitors, but still fit normal
length actions.

You can download the catalog from their website:
http://www.norma.cc/content.asp?Typ=72&Lang=2&Submeny=1&Rubrik=Download

Basically a shortened and necked-down 416 Rigby case. Sort of like the Dakota line of cartridges. Probably more capacity than the 375 Ruger case. It makes perfectly good sense - on paper at least. But isn't the field getting a little crowded?

Maybe if they did a 416 Norma they'd at least have a head start on the pack.

There is something to be said for a "standard factory" cartridge.....necking up the .358 Norma is a duplication of the 416 Taylor......not any great deal!

Using the Rigby case shortened to fit "standard" action lengths seems an attempt to beat Ruger/Hornady to the 416 Ruger punch and I believe a few folks will shell out for the 416 Ruger as it easily duplicates the 416 Rem Mag which requires a magnum length action.

Norma cartridges have never been highly popular in America so I suspect they have the European crowd in mind.

Do you think they'll be bringing back the mammoths to Europe ???

quote:

What is Norma thinking?

They are thinking that at present they're being left out of the "new, beltless biggy cartridge" race and plan to try to do something about it.

I always did think the .308 Norma Magnum was a better cartridge than the .300 Win. Mag. But I am not persuaded we need more confusion brought about by a whole new series of rounds based on the .416 Rigby case................. Well, at least, no-one is going to put a belt on them first!!

Well, do we need another 300 & 338 magnum? No. But I won't complain because it's great to have choices.

Took a look at the pictures of the new calibers.... geez... how much powder do those cases hold? Gonna be some pretty fast bullets coming out of those barrels. Certainly not for me but... to each his own....

BTW... I have also felt that the 308 Norma and 358 Norma were great cartridges and really good choices for those who really need (a very chosen few, might I add) that much power.

Can't really speak to the new Norma Magnum group of cartridges but I am pleased with some of the other things they're doing - 8x68S ammunition, 35 Whelan ammunition and brass, and their new 325-gr. 9.3 Oryx bullet.

unless somebody chambers affordable rifles for it, i predict the same future for them as the old norma's

No one will buy them.

What a waste of capital and production capacity.

quote:

Originally posted by mrlexma:
No one will buy them.

that's a pretty bold statement.
i could be interested in one.

it's a Scandinavian magnum, not something you see everyday.
if it equals or outperform the .300, .340 and .375 Wby Mag, relatively easy conversion from win mags and have reasonably priced brass i'm very interested in one.

are there any pics of these cartridges?

quote:

What a waste of capital and production capacity.

One would think that with rampant increases in metals, ammo and component prices that manuafacturers might concentate on turning out their 15 or 20 most popular centerfires as affordably as possible.

Also, considering that many of the classics are making a come back its seems that new magnums are a saturated niche.

I mean how mnay 7mm-.375 magnums do we need?
How many short mags do we need?
WSM, SAUMs, Dakota's, RUM's, Lazzeronis, the new Rugers etc etc, not too mention those old and seemingly obsolete rounds (if you read too many gun rags) likes the Rem, Win and Weatherby mags.

Its great to have choice and lots to play with, investigate, dream about etc but I reckon if you just can't cut it with a .308-.30-06 - .300win-.300 weatherby then you no-doubt a wild cat tinkerer who can play with some other .30" invention.

These newer cartridges hardly seem innovative or progressive - they do nothing new and don't come in a wildly different package...

quote:

One would think that with rampant increases in metals, ammo and component prices that manuafacturers might concentate on turning out their 15 or 20 most popular centerfires as affordably as possible.

I agree with this idea from the American point of view. But in Europe, things are very different. There is no "right to hunt", and only the nobility and their successors, the wealthy merchant class/industrialists, can afford to hunt. Just look at he guns they buy! To these folks, the cost of the firearms, ammunition, and just paying to maintain huntable game populations mean very little. Here, the costs of hunting & shooting are significant!

quote:

Originally posted by vapodog:
Norma cartridges have never been highly popular in America so I suspect they have the European crowd in mind.

Na...not really. I know of two only that are using their cartridges of .308cal and the .358cal. They are not bad cartridges at all, but they are rare encounted here in denmark in "used guns". There might be some of a following of "Normafans" in sweden and "thereabouts"(hutowlcreek) that will think the new line of cartridges will bring magic, the shootingworld have never thougt of before.

The Norma PH ammo looks sweet though. 350gr for .375, 450gr for .404 and .416. Very cool. Hope these bullets are available to reloaders.

quote:

Originally posted by MikeyB:
The Norma PH ammo looks sweet though. 350gr for .375, 450gr for .404 and .416. Very cool. Hope these bullets are available to reloaders.

They're available. They're Woodleigh bullets.

See:
http://www.woodleighbullets.com.au/Bullet%20List%203.html

Midway carries the Woodleigh bullets.



Cheers!
-Bob F.

Quote: "I agree with this idea from the American point of view. But in Europe, things are very different. There is no "right to hunt", and only the nobility and their successors, the wealthy merchant class/industrialists, can afford to hunt. Just look at he guns they buy! To these folks, the cost of the firearms, ammunition, and just paying to maintain huntable game populations mean very little. Here, the costs of hunting & shooting are significant!"
This is simply not correct Sir, I lived and hunted in Europe long enough, anybody who wants to hunt in Europe can, there is plenty of hunting land, and far from all hunting firearms are fancy and expensive neither.

quote:

Originally posted by El Deguello:
[QUOTE]
I agree with this idea from the American point of view. But in Europe, things are very different. There is no "right to hunt", and only the nobility and their successors, the wealthy merchant class/industrialists, can afford to hunt. Just look at he guns they buy! To these folks, the cost of the firearms, ammunition, and just paying to maintain huntable game populations mean very little. Here, the costs of hunting & shooting are significant!

With all respect Mr Deguello, such statements just show how little you really know about hunting in Europe.
You are way off target to put it that way.

I shall not lecture you about the hunting oportunities in Europe, but you sertainly paint with a wide brush.

quote:

Originally posted by Arild Iversen:

With all respect Mr Deguello, such statements just show how little you really know about hunting in Europe.
You are way off target to put it that way.

I shall not lecture you about the hunting oportunities in Europe, but you sertainly paint with a wide brush.

A wide brush, yes, but he is more on than off.
Norway is VERY different from the rest of Europe. All other countries are influented by the nobelity, of which we exposed in Norway hundreds of years ago. And remember, we are the richest country in the world, we do not have poor people! Around Europe, most common, poor people do not hunt. Even Sweden and Danemark is much more expensive to hunt than Norway. My uncle is a hunters educator in Sweden, and he states that hunting is for people with money. And in Germany, a hunters educations licence costs about 4000 dollars, and takes 6 months to acchieve!

Bent.
We are way OT now regarding the new Norma cartridges , but I stand by what I said to El Deguello.

Europe is so diverse regarding hunting oportunities that such a statement is way off target IMHO.

Europe is so much more than Germany, and I belive that in Finland, Sweden, Norway and Island, a blue collar guy like my self can find lots of big game hunting to an affordable price.
Both on private and state owned land.

I don´t have the impression that roe and boar hunting in Balticum and Poland is targeted at the noblesse eighter.

The rifles I see at the shooting ranges I visit, are more or less middle of the road rifles, many of them made in US of A.

I guess my red stag or moose bull are a lot cheaper than an Elk bull tag in the Rockies

When we are so much OT, any progress with the 425 Fossdal?

quote:

Originally posted by Arild Iversen:

I guess my red stag or moose bull are a lot cheaper than an Elk bull tag in the Rockies

When we are so much OT, any progress with the 425 Fossdal?

Yup, but average still a lot more expensive than the average deer ticket all over US!


Waiting on the brass, waiting on the brass.....
But thanks for asking!

As for the topic, I think they are the least interesting cartridges ever made, mayhaps slightly beaten by the RSAUM's and WSSM's.

quote:

Originally posted by mrlexma:
No one will buy them.

What a waste of capital and production capacity.

mrlexma,
Let's pretend that for example the .338 Norma Magnum out shoots the .338 Lapua Magnum by far, wouldn't there be a market in the US for such a cartridge, maybe from a big governmental organisation that are busy in the Middle East

By the way, in Sweden hunting is and has always been a part of the treaditional living on the country side, eveyone is hunting, rich and poor.

The 9,3x57 is still a popular Moose cartridge shot from your grandfather's Mauser rifle and hammer shotguns are still being used by the hunters.

As for the topic, I think they are the least interesting cartridges ever made, mayhaps slightly beaten by the RSAUM's and WSSM's.[/QUOTE]

Bent
Guess you hit the nail on the head there

Using so much money for R&D on a product that nobody asked for...?