300 WSN or 300 SAUM

07 October 2002, 11:42

JAB

300 WSN or 300 SAUM

I've been thinking of getting one of the new short mags and want to know if there is some reason to get one over the other. I'm leaning towards the Remington...not because of the cartridge, but because I generally prefer Remington to Winchester. Any pros and cons between the cartridges?

Thanks
Jeff

08 October 2002, 05:26

dan belisle

The WSM's have about 7% more case capacity according to gun writer Jon Sundra. Factory velocity specs are too close to call. Winchester is apparently having quality problems right now, Remington not so much (with the rifles, I mean). The Remingtons come in a lighter, handier rifle. The Winchester has a better safety, allows slightly longer COL. I guess that's about it. - Dan

08 October 2002, 23:46

tom holland

quote:
Originally posted by JAB:
I've been thinking of getting one of the new short mags and want to know if there is some reason to get one over the other. I'm leaning towards the Remington...not because of the cartridge, but because I generally prefer Remington to Winchester. Any pros and cons between the cartridges?

Thanks
Jeff

I also am a fan of the Rem but I went ahead and bought a Win FWT in a 300 wsm last week. I don't want to get into a thing like which is best the 243 or 6mm rem. I looked at the Rem model 7 and didn't like the short barrel, it would be a nice rifle to carry around. I've had no problem with feeding or anything else in the model 70 and i've got almost 40 rds fired. I hope to chronograph the short mag and compare it to my 300 win mag and will post it. I'm using 180 bullets with h-4831sc and the groups are under an inch at 100 yds. Trigger pull is alittle heavy but will get a jewell trigger for it later and that may help the groups. Elk season starts for me next Sat so things are alittle rushed with the rifle. Well just my .02 worht. Tom

09 October 2002, 05:08

Brad

Tom, I've had a 300 WSM for a little over a year now and have put several hundred rounds of various handloaded 180's through it. H4831sc won't give you top velocities. H4350 is my first choice as it's proven faster and more accurate than H4831 in my rifle. RL22 is just as accurate as H4350 and is faster yet... use "standard" primers (non magnum) for best results.

Jeff, if you like Remy's, get one. I don't, so got a stainless M70. I shortened the barrel on mine to 22" to make it more handy... I still get 2,900 fps (+) with 180's. I believe the SAUM will never catch up to the WSM in terms of popularity... the WSM is the slightly better cas and is chambered by a variety of makers.

Brad

09 October 2002, 05:33

Stonecreek

The Remington SAUM line is the Sony Betamax of cartridges. That's not to say that there's anything particulary wrong with them, they're just not going to be the dominant seller in this category (and it will be a small category in historical terms, with only a relatively few rifles sold over the next decade).

All the more reason to get the Remington, in my opinion -- I like having something different. Remember the 6.5 Remington Magnum and the .350 Remington Magnum? Good cartridges, along with the .284 Winchester, they were the original short-fats. But don't look for ammo in Walmart.

No, the .300 SAUM won't do anything a .308 chambered in the same gun won't do (except hold two fewer cartridges in the magazine). But then we shooters are not into "practical", we're into "want one of those". Pay your money and take your choice.

09 October 2002, 16:23

lefty315

I don't have either but in most of the local gun stores, Wal-mart and various other retail ammo locations I have yet to see a box of the Remingtons. I have been seeing all of the various Winchester loads and the rifles to go with them. I like Remingtons but if you are going to try and sell guns you have to get them out there.

09 October 2002, 18:04

markus

I have a feeling the 300saum will go the way of the 260 rem and 8mm remington mag. I sure would love a remington in WSM though

09 October 2002, 22:31

tom holland

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Brad:
[QB]Tom, I've had a 300 WSM for a little over a year now and have put several hundred rounds of various handloaded 180's through it. H4831sc won't give you top velocities. H4350 is my first choice as it's proven faster and more accurate than H4831 in my rifle. RL22 is just as accurate as H4350 and is faster yet... use "standard" primers (non magnum) for best results.

Brad, Thanks for the advice and I'm using standard primers. I'll give H-4350 a try after hunting season. What was the difference in Velocity between the two using 180 bullets. Thanks for the information. Tom

10 October 2002, 01:47

<Don Martin29>

Tom,

Consider adjusting your M-70 trigger. In my opinion it's the best design for hunting. I would not waste the money on a Jewel trigger.

http://www.snipercountry.com/Articles/AdjustingWinTrigger.htm

The easiest thing to do is just to replace the trigger spring. Now I have a box of springs but you might find a spring in a ball point pen or some other device to use. I have also ground down and cut off the Win. spring but don't cut too much. Clean the sear surfaces and put some dry moly powder on them. Don't oil them.

10 October 2002, 05:04

Brad

Tom, I went and dug up my WSM load data. It seems with 4 grains MORE H4831sc (vs. H4350) I got around 50 fps LESS velocity... accuracy and velocity was not as consistant with H4831sc as with H4350... funny, as I'm sitting here typing this it occurs to me that perhaps the H4831 would do better with a magnum primer. My top load was 70.5 gr. Maybe that much of this particular powder really requires a magnum primer... hmmm. It would certainly explain the large swings in velocity and inconsistant accuracy I experienced with H4831.

I may give it another try after hunting season!

Good Hunting,

Brad

11 October 2002, 03:25

RogerK

Trigger pull is alittle heavy but will get a jewell trigger for it later and that may help the groups. Elk season starts for me next Sat so things are alittle rushed with the rifle. Well just my .02 worht. Tom[/QB][/QUOTE]

Don't waste money or time replacing the trigger. The Winchester trigger is one of the easiest to adjust. Play with it before you make any change. I'll put the adjustment on mine against almost any after market trigger.

11 October 2002, 08:20

tom holland

Brad: When to the range today with the intend of try mag primers but forgot to put some in (old age) , did put in the oehler 35p to check velocity and with 69.5/h-4831sc the average was 2946fps heck my 30-338 get 3012 with the same bullet 180gr. when I get back i'll try some mag primers. I'm about 39fps less than what nosler manuals gives. Tom

11 October 2002, 12:28

Brad

Tom, that's about exactly what I get with RL22 and 180's out of my 22" bbl. I prefer the Hodgdon stick powder's because they're more temperature stable than RL22.

I'll be curious regarding the mag primers.

Brad

13 October 2002, 03:11

<Charliebuck>

Brad, I use mag primers for my 300wsm loads. 67 grains h4350 165gr bullets. Why do you suggest using regular primers.

13 October 2002, 12:04

Brad

Charlie, with magnum primers in my rifle I get identical velocities to loads with standard primers but at higher pressures (ejector cut-out marks and sticky bolt lift). Last year's first Handloader Magazine article on the 300 WSM reccomended standard primers... at least for H4350 and 180's, I've found that advice to be correct.

Brad

13 October 2002, 19:12

Gatehouse

Brad
I sent you a PM about 300WSM's

thanks

14 October 2002, 03:35

<Charliebuck>

Brad,,Good info I'll give it a try.

14 October 2002, 14:49

Brad

Gatehouse, thanks... just got the mail. I'm using Redding dies... this is my second set and I really like them. The overall quality and finish is a notch above RCBS and just a dollar or two more.

I think all we WSM user's should compare notes at the end of the hunting season and periodically post on load development, etc. What'dya think?

Good Hunting,

Brad

15 October 2002, 04:38

tom holland

Brad, I'm using wilson dies for the 300wsm and they work great. I also plan on getting a body die. I have a pretty good set up so I load at the range and that really helps with the testing. Got a pretty nice bull opening morning with the 300 so off to a good start. Tom

15 October 2002, 13:30

Brad

Tom, congratulation's! Can you post a photo? Our season opens in two weeks...

Brad

15 October 2002, 14:43

tom holland

quote:
Originally posted by Brad:
Tom, congratulation's! Can you post a photo? Our season opens in two weeks...

Brad

I had to quarter him. I was up hunting alone and was a hard pull out that canyon. Will see if I can get one of the horns and post that later. Buck season starts sat so off for a week. At 60 the hills get alittle steeper. Well good luck!
Tom