Ruger no longer lists a 480?

14 May 2007, 23:44

John E Davies

All .480 Ruger revolvers discontinued now!

That is a long discussion. It's sad to see Ruger bail out on one of their own creations - I think they could have waited longer and offered it in some different guns to get interest up. It's only been about 7 years since it was created - so long baby!

I just bought one of the few remaining SRHs in 480 (a 7.5 inch version, which I plan to bob to 4 inches) and expect to take delivery in a day or two.

John Davies
Spokane WA

15 May 2007, 01:23

Buglemintoday

Maybe I should go to the local pawn shop and buy up their Raging Bull in .480

Then I guess whenever ammo prices rocket for .480 I can make it a .475 linebaugh

15 May 2007, 08:26

Lar45

I think that Ruger should do a run of 5 shot Stainless 480 Bisleys. Maybe the market just isn't as big when compared to the Vaquero and Cowboy Action scene?

15 May 2007, 20:08

Fumbler

I called Ruger earlier today.
The lady on the phone said she got a message from her supervisor stating that they've halted manufacturing the Super Redhawk in 480 Ruger due to extraction problems.
She said they will hault production until the extraction problem is fixed, but they have no idea on when or if they will start manufacturing 480s.

Fired cases do stick in my SRH but I didn't think it was a big deal.

15 May 2007, 23:27

the_captain

quote:
Originally posted by Lar45:
I think that Ruger should do a run of 5 shot Stainless 480 Bisleys.

Put on a 5.5" barrel, and you'd have a WINNER! I've wondered for years why they didn't offer that cartridge in a SA revolver.

16 May 2007, 06:25

gohip2000

I hope they come out with a single action 5 cylinder model for the 480

16 May 2007, 06:52

MS Hitman

I wouldn't hold my breathe on that one. Ruger appears to be either too arrogant or ignorant to realize these rounds need to be chambered in a five shot cylinder.

16 May 2007, 09:12

Idaho Sharpshooter

that's funny, my Taurus 5-shot 480 doesn't have any extraction problems...

Rich
DRSS

17 May 2007, 01:50

Paul H

Hmmm, I've got about 4000 rounds through my srh, and haven't had any problems with it.

Not to say a 5 shooter wouldn't be a bad deal, but I'm not likely to part with my six shooter, and I'm looking for another one to cut down to 5".

18 May 2007, 11:05

475Guy

The few SRH's I've shot had no extraction problems whatsoever. I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that the extraction problems were from HOT,HOT loads where somebody is trying to make a 475 Linebaugh out of a 480. No doubt, a 5-shot cylinder would be a boon to bigbore handgun shooters. The resident experts at Ruger have rejected that idea some time ago as they didn't think of it so it'll never happen. Only way to get a 5-shot cylinder is to either have Hamilton Bowen or Jack Huntington do it.

18 May 2007, 19:40

Fumbler

quote:
Originally posted by 475Guy:
The few SRH's I've shot had no extraction problems whatsoever. I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that the extraction problems were from HOT,HOT loads where somebody is trying to make a 475 Linebaugh out of a 480. No doubt, a 5-shot cylinder would be a boon to bigbore handgun shooters. The resident experts at Ruger have rejected that idea some time ago as they didn't think of it so it'll never happen. Only way to get a 5-shot cylinder is to either have Hamilton Bowen or Jack Huntington do it.

Actually from what 480 owners say on other forums it sounds like it's all factory loads that stick.
People are saying their reloads (even full house loads) do not stick.
One guy has the thoery that the brass work hardens after the first shot so it is less likely to stick.

I'm gonna shoot my first reloads this weekend.

18 May 2007, 23:59

Whitworth

I never had an extraction problem using factory loads in mine. Apparently that 6-shot cylinder, despite it's looks is made of a really strong metal.

20 May 2007, 10:28

PUMA454

If it was Factory loads I'd bet money it was Hornady's!!! I had Hornady's stick in my 454 SRH
But when reloaded they didn't stick at all unless I got them close to max !

20 May 2007, 16:36

bfrshooter

I read somewhere that the sticky cases were caused by the steel expanding a little under pressure, combined with soft brass that didn't shrink back enough. I always wondered why they never went to 5 shots and offered it in single actions.
Ruger seems to have a habit of turning their guns into collector items fast. I remember the Bearcat, .357 max and the first hunter models. As soon as a guy gets enough money saved to buy one, they would be gone. Then they appear again years later and if you want one, you better get one fast because they can be gone as fast as they show up.
The .357 max was the most accurate revolver I ever shot but so much was made of the slot in the frame, nobody would buy them. An insert would have cured the problem.

20 May 2007, 18:27

jwp475

The satetement about the chambers expanding when fired is not why the brass sticks in the chambers.The fact is that all steel expands when pressure is applied, that is how the strain guage system measures pressure.The reason that the brass is sticking is that the chambers have a reverse taper in them.When this is removed the brass no longer sticks. How does this abnomaly happen?Durring the chambering process the reamer is pushed in too hard and drifts off line. All of the SRH revolvers do not have the afflicted chambers therefore they do not suffer the problem.....

20 May 2007, 19:20

Juggernaut76

quote:
Originally posted by bfrshooter:
I read somewhere that the sticky cases were caused by the steel expanding a little under pressure, combined with soft brass that didn't shrink back enough.

I posted that here about a year ago. The information came directly from Ruger in response to a call regarding extration problems in my father-in-law's SRH .454. They said not to worry, the steel is plenty strong to handle pressures far beyond SAAMI maximum Casull limit of 65000 psi. The cases only stuck as we approached full power levels with handloads-we never experienced the problem with factory ammunition.

20 May 2007, 20:48

Boxhead

As I recall, Brian Pierce wrote of the cylinder expansion issue some time back in Handloader. It was an issue with the 454 Casull that operates at much higher pressures than the 480. I suspect that Ruger is discontinuing based upon sales. They are really cracking down on non-performers (sales) and dropping a number of rifle/caliber combos too. At the same time they keep coming out with another that is bound to suffer in the sales department like the 450-400. Go figure.

20 May 2007, 22:13

bfrshooter

The Marlin, Hornady developments look much better as Marlin is more open minded then Ruger. It seems as if Ruger management is following in Bill's footsteps. He was VERY hard headed! Why such fine, accurate and strong guns can't advance is beyond me. The BFR is based on the Ruger design and it is no holds barred.
The .480 is a wonderful round and all Ruger has to do is make a few changes.

21 May 2007, 01:18

jwp475

I remember Brain Pierce's article.Rugers claim that the stretch of the cylender is the cause of cases sticking is BS.All chambers (Steel) stretch when under pressure.The reverse taper and lack of chamber burnishing is the cause of the cases sticking.When thisproblem is corrected the cases no longer stick....

There is only about 5,00o PSI average pressure difference between the 480 Ruger and the 475 Linebaugh....

22 May 2007, 03:06

Doubless

quote:
How does this abnomaly happen? Durring the chambering process the reamer is pushed in too hard and drifts off line

Okay, I am confused... I don't know much about the .480, but is it or is it not a straight-walled case? If it is, how in the world does "drifting it off line" create a taper at all? A crooked chamber when compared to the bore centerline, yes, but a tapered chamber? I don't understand.

22 May 2007, 20:23

bfrshooter

Can't happen unless the reamer is tapered!
I see sticky cases in my BFR .475 when I get to max with Hornady brass. After the cases are shot a while, the problem seems to ease. However I now make a habit of reducing the charge 1/2 grain. One boolit I use only shows the best accuracy at max and I have to accept a slightly larger group from the reduced load. Other boolits can take more powder but shoot best under max. Strange because all weigh almost the same. The one that needs more powder has a gas check. All are over groove size and are of the same alloy.

23 May 2007, 06:55

jwp475

quote:
Originally posted by Doubless:
quote:
How does this abnomaly happen? Durring the chambering process the reamer is pushed in too hard and drifts off line

Okay, I am confused... I don't know much about the .480, but is it or is it not a straight-walled case? If it is, how in the world does "drifting it off line" create a taper at all? A crooked chamber when compared to the bore centerline, yes, but a tapered chamber? I don't understand.

A reamer that is forced in too fast and or is dull will allow the unsuported end of the reamer to wobble cut a larger circle than it is suppose to cut. The rear of the reamer is suppted by the shank that is chucked up.Ruger reams all six chambers at the same time with a mulltie head reamer.If you would measure the case's that are sticking you wil find the front of the case to be slightly larger than a portion farther back and this is what causes the sticking.Jack Huntington has corrected this condition numerus times and the cases no longer stick. Ruger's SRH are made from 416 Carpinters Steel and the Carpinter Steels are very hard to machine and that is why this condition is magnified on the SRH revlovers more than is seen in the SBH's..............

23 May 2007, 06:59

jwp475

quote:
By bfrshooter
Can't happen unless the reamer is tapered

Not so, See post above.........

23 May 2007, 07:13

Doubless

"The rear of the reamer is suppted by the shank that is chucked up."

Yes, and the remainder of the reamer is supported by the steel that is around it. There is no way it is going to wobble unless it is getting too hot, hot enough to lose its temper and become elastic.

You are telling me that Ruger is chambering revolvers so fast that the reamers are actually getting hot enough to wobble? Sorry, guy. I ain't buying it.

Yes, steel is "liquid", if you will, and all the atoms are moving. You are telling me that a piece of steel just a few thousandths shy of half an inch in diameter and maybe only a bit over an inch and a half long, is going to WOBBLE?

Now; granted, a reamer that is slightly worn, and maybe that tapers the chamber less than a thousandth smaller at the front is a possibility. But I don't buy chamber reamers wobbling... And a reamer worn a bit on the leading edge would be just that: a tapered reamer. Very slightly tapered, but tapered none the less.

I am hardheaded, I admit. But what you are proposing just doesn't make sense to me. Sorry. Nothing personal, I just can't make that make sense.

23 May 2007, 07:13

Boxhead

quote:
Originally posted by jwp475:
I remember Brain Pierce's article.Rugers claim that the stretch of the cylender is the cause of cases sticking is BS.All chambers (Steel) stretch when under pressure.The reverse taper and lack of chamber burnishing is the cause of the cases sticking.When thisproblem is corrected the cases no longer stick....

There is only about 5,00o PSI average pressure difference between the 480 Ruger and the 475 Linebaugh....

Yes, but there is 17 kpsi difeerence between the 480 and the 454, the 454 being the problem that Pirece was discussing.

23 May 2007, 07:52

jwp475

quote:
Originally posted by Doubless:
"The rear of the reamer is suppted by the shank that is chucked up."

Yes, and the remainder of the reamer is supported by the steel that is around it. There is no way it is going to wobble unless it is getting too hot, hot enough to lose its temper and become elastic.

You are telling me that Ruger is chambering revolvers so fast that the reamers are actually getting hot enough to wobble? Sorry, guy. I ain't buying it.

Yes, steel is "liquid", if you will, and all the atoms are moving. You are telling me that a piece of steel just a few thousandths shy of half an inch in diameter and maybe only a bit over an inch and a half long, is going to WOBBLE?

Now; granted, a reamer that is slightly worn, and maybe that tapers the chamber less than a thousandth smaller at the front is a possibility. But I don't buy chamber reamers wobbling... And a reamer worn a bit on the leading edge would be just that: a tapered reamer. Very slightly tapered, but tapered none the less.

I am hardheaded, I admit. But what you are proposing just doesn't make sense to me. Sorry. Nothing personal, I just can't make that make sense.

Talk to a Machinist and let him Explain it to you in Fact call Jack Huntinton at 530-268-6877 and since he acctually chambers rifles and revolvers let him explain it to you he is who explained it to me.Ask for Jack or Shawn as either one can explain and yes reamers and drill bits can do wobble and or walk out of a straight narrow path wether you beleive it or not........
And like I said measure the cases and let the measurements tell the story........

23 May 2007, 07:55

jwp475

quote:
Originally posted by Boxhead:
quote:
Originally posted by jwp475:
I remember Brain Pierce's article.Rugers claim that the stretch of the cylender is the cause of cases sticking is BS.All chambers (Steel) stretch when under pressure.The reverse taper and lack of chamber burnishing is the cause of the cases sticking.When thisproblem is corrected the cases no longer stick....

There is only about 5,00o PSI average pressure difference between the 480 Ruger and the 475 Linebaugh....

Yes, but there is 17 kpsi difeerence between the 480 and the 454, the 454 being the problem that Pirece was discussing.

Yes I know and the chamber pressure of both cartriges is within SAAMI specs and when the chambers are corrected the cases no longer stick ..........I have seen this with my own eyes.....

23 May 2007, 08:43

Doubless

I think if I were in the business of being a gunsmith, and could convince folks of an inherent problem with a production revolver and maybe gain some business, I might be inclined to do just that.

But probably not...

We shall have to just agree to disagree.

23 May 2007, 16:13

jwp475

Measure the cases and let them do the convinceing,it's that simple..............

How do you explain the cases no longer sticking when the condition is corrected.

23 May 2007, 19:05

Doubless

I know you have heard of burnishing chambers. SASS shooters do it to speed up the ejection rate when they are shooting against a clock. Something as simple as that COULD eliminate sticky cases. Not saying it would, but it is a possibility.

24 May 2007, 01:49

jwp475

quote:
Originally posted by Doubless:
I know you have heard of burnishing chambers. SASS shooters do it to speed up the ejection rate when they are shooting against a clock. Something as simple as that COULD eliminate sticky cases. Not saying it would, but it is a possibility.

Yes,burnishing chambers helps with extraction and I believe that the chambers should be burnihed.
The reverse taper that we are talking about only needs to be a few tenths of a thousanths to create a sticky chamber,not enough to see with the naked eye,but the cases can be measured with an acurate micrometor and they tell the truth. As Grissom on C.S.I. say's Follow the evidence......

26 May 2007, 21:45

SWD

JWP475 is correct. Reamers can easily be forced to cut incorrectly. Dull tooling in really tough materials can do all sorts screwy things!
Revolver cylinders with back taper in the chambers is not all that uncommon. Talk with a good revolver smith!

29 May 2007, 11:22

SAFARIKID

DECIDED TO SELL MY RARE 480 ALASKAN...SEE CLASSIFIED BELOW,THANKS

29 May 2007, 15:42

bfrshooter

OK, You all convinced me it is possible. Might be a market for a finish reamer here to just straighten them out.
I just found a Ruger add in my new Handgunner that is showing the Alaskan in .454, .480 and .44. Funny it is not on their site.

19 June 2007, 20:31

Fumbler

I finally got to shoot some reloads.
The reloads were RCBS 405gr cast flat nose over Unique.
Definately not a hot load.
The brass did not stick at all. I have yet to test whether hot reloads stick.

I do not believe it is a reamer problem.
Factory loads extract fine after they're pulled out about 3/16"
If you reinsert the factory cases then they go in fine most of the way but have a lot of friction in the last 3/16-1/4 inch.
If the ends of the reamers wondered off center then it would be progressively harder to extract as the case exits the chamber.

I love shooting this gun even if factory cases stick a little.

20 June 2007, 22:56

Paul H

390-400 gr and 21 gr of H-110 will clock 1200 fps give or take from a 7 1/2" SRH 480. Those loads just drop right out, and shoot into tiny groups. I never added more powder once I found that load as it grouped so nice.

The only time I got sticky loads is when working up with a 460 gr bullet. I found my top load was 19 gr H-110 for 1050 fps, though I worked up a bit more and it was getting sticky, so I backed down, and 19 gr grouped the best.

To me the slight stickyness of factory loads is a good thing, as it gave me a reliable pressure indicator. My loads don't stick, ergo pressure is less than factory loads and I'm happy.

22 June 2007, 08:00

Fumbler

quote:
Originally posted by Paul H:

To me the slight stickyness of factory loads is a good thing, as it gave me a reliable pressure indicator. My loads don't stick, ergo pressure is less than factory loads and I'm happy.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but wouldn't new brass stickiness be a poor benchmark for high pressure?
As I understand, brass becomes work hardened as you shoot it, thus your reloaded brass would stretch (and theoretically) stick less with the same pressures of a factory load.