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45 acp obliterates cantalope, 9mm does not.

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17 October 2004, 04:20
Tech
45 acp obliterates cantalope, 9mm does not.
My father in law and I took a little shootin trip out to the sticks(normally I shoot at the public range) to try out my new sks. We brought along the sks, both our shotguns, my .22, my .45 colt black hawk, my glock 21, and his berreta 92fs.

I bought about a dozen cantalopes to see what kind of carnage that the sks could cause them, also a 12 pack of cola for added fun.

The sks did indeed do some damage to the lopes, especially with the hollow point ammo. However towards the end I decided to shoot one with my glock 21 using a .45 acp federal hydrashock bullet, and to my surprise the cantalope just violently exploded into tiny little pieces, I shot two more with the same result. So I tell my father in law to try it with his 9mm using gold dot ammo, the 9mm caused similar damage to the sks, but not even close to what the .45 did.

I know that defense against cantalopes does not correspond well with defense against a human, but from my little inadvertant experiment I have to wonder how a 9mm is even considered in the same ball park with the .45.

Of course I considered the fact that the .45 going slower allowed it to expand to a greater degree than the 9mm, or the sks, but that should also translate to a defensive shooting as well.

What are your thoughts on my little experiment?
17 October 2004, 05:01
Sean VHA #60013
Quote:

What are your thoughts on my little experiment?





Well, next time I need to defend myself against a killer cantilope, I will reach for the 45acp



On our damage permit deer, the 9mm definately does a better job of killing than the 45acp, at least in my experience. On small and medium game, it performs much like a 357 mag, whereas the 45acp performs more like a very light loaded 44special [NOT like a 44special with hard casts], with inferior penetration and trajectory.



Just my own experience with the two.
17 October 2004, 05:35
mete
The attack of the killer cantalope !! Actually I've done tests years ago on woodchucks .When a 'chuck was hit with a 9mm he would RUN back to his hole. A similar hit with a 45 and he would WALK back to the hole. I never got a second hit on a wounded chuck since don't care to shoot at a running target with a pistol but with the 45 I could.BTW I can't see any difference between the 40 and 45. Do your tests on live things !
17 October 2004, 06:23
derf
Right after WW2 when the bean counters were going through the German records, some nit realized that in the Medical and Hospital records there were very few accounts of woundings and subsequent care for soldiers injured by the 45ACP rounds. Their conclution was that the 45ACP must therefore be an ineffectual cartridge Until they talked to a trauma surgeon who told them that they were looking at the wrong records for the information that they sought. They should have been looking in the Mortuary records! derf
17 October 2004, 06:43
Sean VHA #60013
Quote:

The attack of the killer cantalope !! Actually I've done tests years ago on woodchucks .



Mete, good to chat with a fellow Woodchuck bullet tester

In my experience, the 9mm 115 grn was a poor performer, but with 124grn did well, and with 147grn hp's loaded well in a good gun [I use a 6" match barreled Glock 17 for my 9mm hunting] it does better on chucks than the 45acp with any load.

Just my own observations, that the 124 and 147grn bullet classes are where the 9mm shines on game. When you used the 9mm, what bullet weight were you using?


17 October 2004, 08:59
steveno
I heard a guy say that after he had shot trees (he didn't say what kind of trees)with a 9 mm , 40 S & W and a 45 acp. he came to the conclusion because the 40 took more bark off the tree that the 40 would be a better stopper. so let that be a lesson the next time you are hunting in the forest.
17 October 2004, 09:14
mete
Sean, the woodchuck is a good test media since they are tough out of proportion to their size. But of course there are many variables.I did my tests years ago ,late 70s,before there were many really effective HPs.A hit with a 9mm would sometimes make the chuck move around as if he had been stung by a bee.A hit with a 45 and their whole body would shudder.I hit one 4 times [not good placement]and I could see him shudder each time and finally he stood still, still on his feet !!I used various bullets and the effect on feral dogs was similar.Tests included the 380 which made me quickly reject that as a defense round !!.Assuming same bullet construction the bigger diameter does more damage, a simple fact of life. I'm hunting deer with a 45-70 now and am impressed with it, and it does it's work well without high velocity.There seem to be many who have a problem with their macho and insist on loading a 45-70 to 458 mag loads but that's not necessary certainly for deer.
17 October 2004, 13:56
fredj338
A 9mm/124gr +P will get you better results, but then again so will a .45acp/185gr +P. I wouldn't want to stop either, w/ or w.o a cantelope. .
18 October 2004, 02:20
Puncher
Quote:

Right after WW2 when the bean counters were going through the German records, some nit realized that in the Medical and Hospital records there were very few accounts of woundings and subsequent care for soldiers injured by the 45ACP rounds.................They should have been looking in the Mortuary records! derf


Many years ago, I read a story in some gun rag about a physicist and a surgeon that pooled their knowledge and researched the stories that came out of WWII about the effects of the .45 ACP nato ball load. Leaving out 99% of the story, they determined that the frequency of the .45 ACP nato ball load was on a perfect frequency match with the human heart. That particular combination has the ability to "switch off" the heart!
18 October 2004, 09:04
derf
That is interesting Puncher! derf
18 October 2004, 14:29
Tech
Not sure that I could have improved on the results with any other caliber or load, maybe equal.

I think next I will gun for some killer watermelons, or perhaps that evil newspaper.

By the way after that demonstration of the .45 Hydra shock, my father in law is now set on trading in his Berreta for a Glock 30. I think that is a wise choice.
18 October 2004, 14:34
Tech
I could see how the 9mm would do better than .45 on deer sized game, since it will give you more penetration, although a smaller wound channel. But against a human, give me a .45acp, against those deer give me my .45colt loaded hot with a hardcast. Or maybe a .45super.
18 October 2004, 14:38
Tech
I am not the kind of guy that kills an animal unless it were for food, or defense, but I have nothing against anyone doing a little varmint control, in fact they are doing the rest of us a service. So I will just have to stick with the fruitier aspect of my targets, seems a shame to waste perfectly good melons though.
18 October 2004, 21:45
derf
The melons aren't wasted Tech. If left laying around the scraps will go to feed small critters and insects. Plus the seeds just might start growing a whole new batch of free targets. derf