varget powder and rcbs die question

18 December 2001, 17:48

<songdog_sniper>

anyone ever had any problems loading with varget and it being a compresed powder
i am starting with 42 grains in a fedral 308 case and 168 grain seria hpbt
i think i won't even start compresing the powder until up around 43.5 grains.
any special seating procedures you need to know for loading compresed powder?

also i new to reloading and am going to use the rcbs dies

can someone tell me exactly how to set up the seating die in my lee aniversy kit press

when i thread the seating die in should i see the die threads come through the bottom before stoping and checking thanks.

18 December 2001, 18:15

LE270

To adjust the seating die, I put a case -- without powder or bullet -- that I expect to load in the shell holder and then raise the press ram to its top position. I then screw the seating die over the case until the seating die begins to go tight on the case. I then back off very slightly -- about 1/8 of a turn of the die. I then tighten the lock ring on the die. This will insure that the case is fully into the seating die, but not so far that the die begins to crimp the case on the bullet.

You should have backed the bullet seating stem out a bit -- at least .1 to .15 inch, and probably more, but not so much that the bullet isn't seated into the case at all -- before you seat your first bullet. You then seat a bullet, and then measure the cartridge overall length. (You really need a caliper to do good work getting the right or desired overall length in loading.) You then screw the seating plug down a bit and seat the bullet again, then measure again. Repeat this procedure until you get the bullet seated to the depth you want (i.e., the overall length of the cartridge is the length you want).

After you get the seater adjusted right, you needn't measure every load, as they will be consistent in length by the second or third round if you've adjusted things properly and tightened them down so they do not slip between loads.

These techniques will be the same regardless of the brand of reloading dies you are using.

There's no special trick or technique to loading with compressed charges. Just seat the bullet in the usual way, to whatever depth you've determined you want to seat it. Unless you are using VERY compressed charges of powder, you will hardly notice that the charge is being compressed as you raise the ram on the press.

[This message has been edited by LE270 (edited 12-19-2001).]

18 December 2001, 18:30

<songdog_sniper>

thank you le
i am a first time loader just wanting to check some things out

18 December 2001, 19:00

<BigBob>

One thing you may try is to pour the powder into the case slowly. This will allow the powder to settle and not take up as much room in the case as it might if just dumped into the case.

------------------
BigBob

19 December 2001, 03:37

<Daryl Elder>

SongDog, I was using 44gr Varget and Hornady 168gr BTHPM for my M1-A and the loads were not compressed. Try a drop tube.

19 December 2001, 04:47

LE270

I should add that if you already have a loaded round with the bullet seated to the depth you want (subject to considerations of bullet shape, as I'll explain below), you can use it to adjust bullet seating depth. You take that round and put it into the shell holder and raise it into the seating die -- the seating die that you've adjusted as I specified above. You should have backed out the seating plug far enough that you know it will not engage the loaded round when you raise it into the seating die. Then screw down the seating plug until it is tight against the bullet of the already-loaded round. Then remove the loaded round and turn the seating plug down slightly more, perhaps 1/8 of a turn -- this is to take care of the stretching that occurs when you actually seat a bullet. Then seat a bullet with the die and seating plug set in this way, and measure the overall length of the new round. It should be equal to, or very near, the length of the original test round. You can then fine-adjust the seating plug to get the seating depth you want.

There are at least three issues in determining a seating depth: (1) Most rifles will be most accurate with the bullet seated to just touch the lands of the rifling, or backed off just a few thousandths of an inch. (2) Unless you are shooting a single shot, or using a magazine rifle as a single shot, you will need the final loaded round to be short enough to work through the magazine of the rifle. (3) Generally, you will want a bullet inserted far enough into the neck of a case that there will be sufficient friction between the case neck and the bullet so that the bullet is held in place properly. This is especially important for hunting rounds.

Given that -- usually anyway -- you will want the bullet seated so that it touches or nearly touches the lands, the shape of the bullet will affect the desired seating depth. Long, slim, pointed bullets can be seated much farther out, because their points will extend into the barrel some distance before the body of the bullet touches the lands, but this means that they may be too long to work through the magazine, so you will have to check that. (One exception is rifles with freebore, such as Weatherby magnums. You generally cannot make the bullets touch the lands in such rifles.) With round nosed bullets, they may touch the lands although seated much deeper because they are larger in diameter nearer the point of the bullet.

Seating depth of the bullet is one of the variables that can have a significant effect on the velocity and/or accuracy of the loaded rounds.

[This message has been edited by LE270 (edited 12-19-2001).]

19 December 2001, 17:22

LE270

quote:
Originally posted by BigBob:
One thing you may try is to pour the powder into the case slowly. This will allow the powder to settle and not take up as much room in the case as it might if just dumped into the case.

This may work. I almost always weigh each charge individually -- I own a powder measure, but almost never use it -- and then pour it into the case with a powder funnel. Since I usually use stick-type powders (as opposed to ball ones), I've found that rapping the case head of the powder-loaded cases on the loading bench a bit will settle the powder down into the case if I want to do so before seating the bullet.

19 December 2001, 18:38

denton

I use 46 grains of Varget in a .308, and it's not especially compressed. Something isn't right. Are you using mil brass? My mil brass holds about 1 1/2 grains less powder than my commercial brass. That's why I don't use it anymore... creates more pressure.

Speaking of pressure, the advise about getting best accuracy with the bullet touching the rifling does require that you back off on the load. If the bullet is in contact with the rifling, it creates significantly higher pressures, but is sometimes the very best way to go.

Good loading! Hope all this helps.

19 December 2001, 19:19

<songdog_sniper>

thanks guys at he time i worte this post i hadn't loaded any powder yet in any shells yet now that i have loaded up to 42.7 grains of varget there is plenty of room. i was just doing one of those what ifs. by the way one thing about varet you can't double charge a shell since 1/2 of te second charge will spill out on the ground. i tried it on purpose just to see.

20 December 2001, 09:40

LE270

quote:
Originally posted by songdog_sniper:
one thing about varet you can't double charge a shell since 1/2 of te second charge will spill out on the ground.

Double charging is rarely a problem with rifle calibers because most of them use enough powder to fill the case at least to 75% of its available space, and usually much more than that. Double charging is a serious possibility with pistol rounds because many of them use small amounts of fast burning powder, an amount that uses up significantly less than 1/2 of the available cartridge space.