I was digging around through some boxes of ammo left from Dads estate and found 6 or 7 boxes of WW-2 06 150 grain ammo from the Denver Arsenal in 1942. I remember breaking down a ton of this stuff in the 60's to recover the powder/case/bullets. I would pop the primer with a punch like the Lee and then rinse the cases in water(corrosive primers) For whatever reason, I had in my mind that the original load was 50 grains of IMR4895, but it turns out that the load was 52.0 gr.! I looked in my old manuals from the 60's and that was not quite, but hard up against the max load. I was kind of surprised that they were loaded that hot. I have been loading 49.0 of modern IMR4895 with a 150 for my Garand and it shoots well. Just thought I would share this for general info.

My lot of Milsurp 4895 is a bit slower than modern IMR 4895 so the difference you noted as being hotter, may be or just that much more powder to come up to speed, more but not by that much!

Military powder varies lot to lot and they adjust loading to obtain, pressure, velocity and accuracy. One can afford to work it up when they have a train car(s) load vs a one pound can.

Years ago Jeff Bartlett told me that one particular power varied so much lot to lot that he was amazed that the military accepted some lots.

I think the mil stuff was H4895 which is a little slower than IMR. That's what I always used in my Garand.
Why break them down? I just shoot them up and make sure to clean with hot soapy water afterwards. Had a bunch of tracers a while back.
Fun to shoot at night but they sure do ricochet!

Hodgen did not exist in 1942. They got into the business after the war by buying up and repackaging surplus powder that was made by Dupont. IMR4831 was used in 20 mm and IMR4895 was used in 30/06. The IMR stood for Improved - Military Rifle. I believe it was well into the seventies before they ran out of the surplus. Since the current admin is chopping up 50 cal ammo cans to keep them out of our hands, I guess we will never see the day of cheap surplus powder again. Blacktailer, I was a teenager and Dad had thousands of rounds of the surplus /06 and I probably put up 20 lbs of pulled powder for loading other calibers. The mercuric primers will actually attack the brass and weaken it unless you wash it soon after shooting.

I think your 49 grain load is hot for a Garand. The Garand was issued in 1936, the loads of the era where pretty mild by today's standards. I was going some of my own research, in the Feb 1939 Army Ordnance magazine there is a statement that “The velocity of the ammunition must be between 2570 and 2630 fps at 78 feet from the muzzle. Pressure must not exceed 48,000 psia. They were using IMR 1185, a powder I have never seen. While this might have been the 174 grain bullet, this is still a lot slower than off the shelf ammunition. I tested ball ammunition and came up with my own loads which are a lot lighter than yours.


M98 26" 1-10 Wilson Barrel


150 gr FMJBT TW 56 Ball

24 Mar 04 T= 70 ° F

Ave Vel = 2680
Std Dev = 31
ES = 78
Low = 2620
High = 2698
N = 6


150 gr FMJBT 1966 Ball

14 Nov 2011 T= 68 ° F

Ave Vel = 2596
Std Dev = 47
ES = 190
Low = 2498
High = 2688

Group Size: Surprisingly good ammunition.

150 gr Sierra Match HPBT 47.5 IMR 4895 CCI#34 190 grs ≤ WWII brass ≤ 195 grs
OAL 3.290"
24 Mar 04 T= 70 ° F

Ave Vel = 2722
Std Dev = 26
ES = 76
Low = 2673
High = 2749
N = 10

Group Size: All in ten ring, very mild load, primers backed out.



M1 Garand 5 82X XXX


150 gr Sierra Match HPBT 47.5 IMR 4895 CCI#34 190 ≤ WWII ≤ 195 OAL 3.290"
24 Mar 04 T= 70 ° F

Ave Vel = 2619
Std Dev = 28
ES = 101
Low = 2559
High = 2660
N = 16


M1 Garand 5 9XX XXX



150 gr Sierra Match HPBT 47.5 IMR 4895 CCI#34 190 ≤ WWII ≤ 195 OAL 3.30"
24 Mar 04 T= 70 ° F

Ave Vel = 2630
Std Dev = 33
ES = 109
Low = 2580
High = 2689
N = 16

49.0 gr of IMR4895 is the NRAs load for the M1 for 147-155gr FMJ or HPBT. As you noted it shoots well - in mine also with 147 and 150gr.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike1:
49.0 gr of IMR4895 is the NRAs load for the M1 for 147-155gr FMJ or HPBT. As you noted it shoots well - in mine also with 147 and 150gr.

Yes I know that, you can find a summary of the NRA loads at Master Po's Temple:
http://masterpostemple.bravepages.com/M1load.htm

But, I know the speeds over my chronograph, and I know that these rifles are over a half century old, and that if my rifle breaks or bends something with NRA loads, the NRA won't pay to fix it. So, I use my judgment in determining what loads to feed my Garands.

lee440,In 1942 and even way earlier the US didn't use mercury in US ammo. A lot of people confuse mercury primers and corrosive primers. Mercury in promers is not a corrosive/erosive compound but that isn't to say other things in the primer mix won't cause problems. Mercury can not be washed off/out. It amalgamates(dissolves)into the brass. With repeated firing the brass becomes more brittle. The brass is not useless after only one firing with a mercury primer.
Cleaning well after using common corrosive ammo, as the US did make(as well as most other foreign ammo makers), is a wise thing to do. Is saves barrels and bolt faces from pitting. But brass is uneffected by common perchlorate priming compounds or it's residual salts.
In 1939 there was no SAAMI(or CIP) or piezo or strain gages. All psi's given in that era are CUP values, as in 48,000(CUP)psi. The 30'06 ammo is now loaded at 50KCUP. It was lowered some years back. If one downloads ammo to less than max, other accuracy spots can be found to save on shooters shoulders, guns, brass ammo costs, and maybe a few other things as well.Best

May be I'll find the edit feature next time. promers=primers and "It was lower some years back" is what should have been typed instead of "lowered".

Slamfire- I started with 4895 by looking at Master PO's data, then went down the same cautious path as you. My M1 is ~1953 vintage, so I am a bit careful as well. Using 47g charge and 168g HP match. I respect your wisdom.