I currently own a 300 WM and am buying a new gun. I really like my 300 WM. I was looking at bumping up the velocity a bit and going to a 300 RUM but I don't think I can handle the recoil. What are your thoughts on the 300 WSM? From what I have seen and read it seems to be about 100 fps slower than the 300 WM(PS I reload). Does that seem right? I would look at purchasing the 300 WSM but it seems to be slower than the 300 WM and I don't want to give up any velocity! I would appreciate your opinion on any of the 300 WM, WSM or RUM!
Thanks
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I doubt you can load the WSM to the same velocities as the Win Mag.
[This message has been edited by Bill (edited 07-26-2001).]
With careful handloading in each, the WSM is 100 fps slower than the Win Mag with bullets fo equal weight. I find no disadvantage. The energy and killing effect of the WSM is more than sufficient for game in its class (everything in NA short of brown bear) out to 400 yards. The trajaectory advantage of the Win Mag amounts to about 2" at 400 yards, or about 25 yards of additional sure killing range. I find that inconsequential.
The WSM carries easier and lighter, and mounts quicker, with its 24" barrel and short action. It burns less powder, which means more barrel life. Recoil is noticeably lighter. Altogether a better hunting package than the Win Mag.
The accuracy is also better. The Win 180 PP factory load shoots well within 1 MOA. My favorite handloads shoot under 3/4 MOA, including 200 gr SBT and 150 gr SST. Cases are on their 11th reload.
I sold my Win Mag after i got the WSM. But if you are hung up on maximum velocity for whatever reason, the WSM is slower than the Win Mag.
I also find the .308 Win superior to the .30-06 within its range of deer and black bear and hogs. Again it is more accurate, handles faster, lighter to tote all day, and has sufficient killing power and trajectory out to 400 yards.
For the one-gun hunter the WSM is absolutely the best choice. Up north maybe 25 yards of extra range is important, so keep the Win Mag. But I have not heard any great hosannas sung about the RUM cartridge. In my opinion, that level of energy is a waste in .30 calibre and ought to go into a bigger bore like the .338
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Even less powder than a WSM, same bbl length, perhaps 1/2" longer action??
I presume the 06 has one definite disadvantage:
Everybody and his brother has one, it�s not new, and what would the gun rags write about?
Good shooting! H
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Growler
I have killed quite a few deer with it over the years at ranges from 75 yards to 350 yards and with a lung shot not one deer has failed to die within a few seconds and within 15 yards of where he was hit. Most dropped where they stood.
The case has a long neck and gentle shoulder for assisting in the accurate handloading process. The caliber was the 1000 yard par excellence, (score) record holder for many years. Actually, most .300WM have identical ballistics with 24" barrels and the new Winchester short magnum is slightly under.
I would not feel under gunned against the Weatherby or Ultra mags except at long range of over 400 yards, where I won't take a shot anyhow, or maybe against bears with heavy bullets. Since I do not hunt Grizzly Bears, I do not feel the need to have anything more than 3000 FPS with a 180 grain bullet.
- 180gr FS, reload - 3021fps
- 150gr Nosler Balistic Tip,reload- 3391 fps
I really like shooting this rifle. I will be taking it for stone sheep in September. Rifle is a Browning Composite Stalker with a 23"bbl, weighs 6.5lbs and shoots like a lazer. 3 shot 180gr largest group - .75". 3 shot 150gr largest group - .63". 5 shot groups at 300yds largest 3.23".
...Peter
I too am very happy with this rifle. It meets and may exceed what the folks at winchester/Browning said it would.
As far as doubting that less powder can go as fast as more in a longer case, I too found it hard to believe. Look back at the PPC cartridges, and the .308 winchester. These outperformed what they SHOULD be unable to do. The .308 uses less powder to go the same velocity that an 06 does all the time. Short fat powder columns burn more efficiently than long skinny ones. Notice also that the WSM uses powders of medium burn rate.
I just got some 180 Horn sst's., but haven't had the chance to load and test them. Tough decision whether to go with the 165, or 180 for whitetails. I'm waiting for my present scope to get back from Tasco either fixed or replaced, or the funds to get what will stay on there, probably a Leupold vari x 111 4.5 x 14 AO Matte. Wideners has it for $410.00
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if you run, you just die tired
I can't bare to see you suffering with such an antique caliber as the 300 H&H. You poor sod. I feel it is my noble duty to take it off your hands for a small pittance, that way you can get yourself a "real" 30 magnum. Those poor deer you killed with it over the years must have truly suffered for at least a microsecond or two.
Seriously, it's amazing how many poeple feel that way. The 300 H&H is everything you need in a 30 cal magnum, the rest of them are trying to re-invent the wheel. It's all sales hype. Besides, the new squirts just don't have the class of a vintage H&H, and they never will.
With identical bullets there isn't but a few inches difference in drop between any of them at 400, or even 500 yards. If you can hit it with a 300 Ultra, you can hit it with a 300 H&H, and the deer, antelope, ground hog, or whatever will NEVER KNOW the difference.
It's amazing that some guys just don't understand that. They will spend $1000 bucks or more for a new hunting rifle, dies, more expensive brass and burn a disproportionate amount more powder, for VERY little difference in trajectory. And feel that they have something truly better. ? I guess I don't get it.
One of my hunting buddies has a 300 Norma that he's had for almost 40 years. 40 years later the Ultra arrives on the scene. There isn't enough difference between them to spit at. When you're measuring drop by the feet, (at 500 yds), 3,4, or even 6 inches difference is invisible. Give me a break.
I'm sorry for "ranting", but at least be honest guys and admit that you got pulled in by hype.
If you can't hit it with an H&H, you won't hit it with an Ultra. Period. Deal with it.
I didn't have a 30 caliber anything. As long as I was going to get a 30 something I thought this would make a good choice. I think I was right. With the junk remington has been putting out I doubt the SAUM Is going to be much competition, accuracy wise anyway.
The WSM is NOT about hype or false claims. It is a short LIGHT 30 magnum rifle made for mountain hunting or long hikes on the flats.
The long gentle shoulder of the 300 H&H is a good thing for handloaders? News to me for sure. I've always heard a sharp shoulder was better for controling headspace. Also that gentle shoulder allows the brass to flow so easily that cases need trimming after every reload. I have yet to trim my cases for my WSM after 3 firings on some of them.
It seems that lots of people have made up their mind they won't be freinds with the new kid on the block. Fine, don't buy one. Win-browning can't make rifles fast enough the keep up with demand.
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if you run, you just die tired
These are all good rounds. One point I haven't seen mentioned in this thread is the size bullets you plan to shoot. Sure, in handloads a .308 pretty much stays with a .30-'06 -- until you get up to around 180-grain bullets. Same is true for the magnum .30s: case capacity matters more when you shoot heavier bullets.
I've had a .300 Win Mag for years, and it will probably stay my primary hunting rifle, but I recently picked up a .300 RUM. Why? I got tired of running into big bears on float hunts for moose, and wanted a flat-shooting rifle better equipped to handle them. The RUM shoots 200-grain bullets at almost the velocity the Win Mag throws 165-grainers. (I've got to 3200 fps with no pressure signs.) But it's too heavy to go up a mountain with me.
Personally, I can't see any reason why someone shooting 165-or-smaller-grain bullets would want a RUM. But we all hunt in different circumstances, and have different tastes in firearms.
Jim
redleg
P.S. I've only glanced at the 300 WSM article so I can only trust that it's a good read as most everything that comes from Barnsness is.
I recently bought a 300 WSM and have quickly grown very fond of it and think it is a real winner. I just wish it liked 165 gr Scirocco's as well as it likes 150 Nosler BT's.
Keep shooting your .300 Win on everything from deer through moose, and spend your "new gun" money on maybe a coyote or varmint rifle, or target rifle, or whatever you don't have but wish you did.