I bought a .243 a couple of years ago. And while I've gotten some pretty weird crap to shoot great. All of my .243 loads SUCKED. Differnent powders and bullets the only thing in common was they all shot like crap.

Fast forward to the present I bought a savage 99 it shoots good with factory ammo but as usual my handloads suck. I tried my loads in a friends CZ550 which shoots factory ammo quite well. Guess what my handloads again SUCK. Heck this time around to try and rule out my sucking I duplicated a load from alliants web page to the letter same brass same primer same charge weight same COL. And yet all I get is suck. After I sell this one I swear i'll never own another .243

Anybody else have a cartridge that just doesn't agree with them?

well, i thought i had a caliber that sucked for me, although the .270 is a very good cartridge. I wasn't getting very decent accuracy with any loads, even some of the "best" ones that others use. So, i picked up a different kind of bullet, and loaded some up near max, took them out yesterday, and one ragged hole at 100 yards. could cover it with a dime. not bad, huh? just keep trying.

Pretty strange I've never had a .243 that didn't shoot sub MOA. Even with factory Ammo. With handloads .5 MOA is pretty standard.

quote:

Originally posted by Jay Johnson:
Pretty strange I've never had a .243 that didn't shoot sub MOA. Even with factory Ammo. With handloads .5 MOA is pretty standard.

+1 !

I get pretty much the same results with my maximum load with N160 and a 100 grs. Partition.

Do you reload for any other calibers? Do they shoot well? If so, its not technique, so why don't you invest in a set of inexpensive Lee dies and try them. You may have a bad die and it is your problem. Kudude

quote:

Originally posted by kudude:
Do you reload for any other calibers? Do they shoot well? If so, its not technique, so why don't you invest in a set of inexpensive Lee dies and try them. You may have a bad die and it is your problem. Kudude

I load for about 15 other calibers, and I get great groups with everything from 7.62x39 to 300wby Hell even my MAS36 in 7.5x54mas shoots 1.25" groups regularly. During the course of this little saga 2 diffrent die sets were used, firsr RCBS and then lyman.

I've tried all sorts of powders. Varget IMR4831 Re22 Imr4320 even IMR5010

I'm tellin ya .243 and me just don't get along.

Like the previous posters, I have had good success with my .243 shooting most anything well. No factory ammo shoots worse than 1.5MOA and several factory loads do better than that with the Federal 70 grain Nosler BT consistently .75 MOA. But one thing I noticed when I started handloading for it, is that it doesn't shoot its best with maximum or near maximum charges. Not that it shoots badly with max or near max charges, just that it does shoot its best. It also shoots horribly with relatively light charges. 2-3 MOA. For whatever reason, and I don't know why, it seems to shoot best (.5 MOA) with charges near the middle of range for a given powder.

My point is that if you aren't loading the full range of possible charges for the powder you are using try less or more as the case may be within the range for that powder. You may get some surprising results.

LWD

I've never had the problem you speak of. My Remington 600 has been reworked with a Douglas number 4 contour bbl and it's 26" long mounted in a McMillian stock. If I do my part even a Max it will shoot sub .5 MOA with 70 gr Blitzkings at near 3600 fps.

I had a .243 Sako years ago and it took 200 different loads to find one that would shoot. It was not a fast load either. Trajectory was horrible.

Sounds like a bad gun.....no need to blame the caliber. Shit happens.....get rid of it and move on.

I hate to admit this, but I am riding in the same boat as you. I have had a number of .243 Winchester rifles and have never had one that I could depend on for better than MOA groups. That has included a Shultz & Larsen "free rifle", a pre-'64 M70 FW, a Ruger No. 1, a Sako heavy barreled factory varminter, a custom mountain rifle, and a couple of others. The mountain rifle is especially vexing. Has a Rem 600 action, a 22" Schneider barrel fitted by Paul Marquart, a high dollar aftermarket composite stock ($550 fitted and finished, in 1987 dollars), a Leupold 3.5-10 scope, etc.

I'm not saying there's anything wrong with most .243's. I have friends who have .243 rifles that shoot like benchrest guns. But I'VE never had one that I consider acceptably accurate. All mine are now gone except a TCR-83 that is too handy to sell, and the mountain rifle which I have too much money in to sell.

For some reason, I have pretty much the same luck any time I try to use IMR 4320 powder in anything, too.

Sometimes life is just....life.



(For 70 years I spent most of my money on women, beer, and guns. The rest I just wasted.)

I've never had much luck with the .243 either accuracy-wise. I know they have a good rep. I must be doing something very wrong. But my 6mm/284 shoots extremely well........

quote:

Originally posted by El Deguello:
I've never had much luck with the .243 either accuracy-wise. I know they have a good rep. I must be doing something very wrong. But my 6mm/284 shoots extremely well........

El D -

If you find out what it is, please tell us here. I must be doing the same thing and would sure like to overcome it. As you, I have other 6's that shoot very well, including a .244 Rem Model 725, several 6 PPCs (40-X, Wichita, XP-100), a 6m/m TallDog (Stolle Panda), 6mm TCU (Contender), 6 m/m Donaldson Ace (RPA Quadlite), and a few more. But I sure ain't romancing my .243 Winnies correctly.....

I rebarreled my 700 rem a few years ago. before the barrel went away shot exellent with 107grns
after new barrel it wouldn't put 2 in the same
target luckily i had some 60 grns loadeds it would shoot those through the same hole all day
that rifle still dosen't like bullets over 75grns

I will tell you a good idea to try. My 7mm08 is just a perfect rifle with anything that I load in it and it kills really well. I decided to load it down for my wife with some 100 gr Sierra Gameking HPBT which makes it a lot like a 243 and it shoots really sweet.
If you want a very versatile caliber on your next purchase try and 7mm08 and play around and have a good time.

It seems to me to be the rifle, at first, since you've used two sets of dies and they both produce loads that give you unsatisfactory results on target. But, since they also shoot bad in friends' rifles, have you rolled the cartridges across a flat table to see if you have excessive runout?
I've had ten .243s, most going to my grandchildren, but three still are in my possession. Each seemed to be a rule unto itself as to favorite bullet/powder. All did seem to shoot satisfactorily (1 to 1-1/2" groups) with 4350 and 85gr or heavier bullets.

I wouldn't make a guess as to how many .243 rifles I've fired, but it would have to be over 100. This is one of the easiest cartridges I know of to get to shoot under 1 in. Your problem isn't a cartridge it has to be a rifle. Load some with 100 Sierras and 41-42 grains of 4350, then the same charge of H414. One will shoot under an inch. That's been my experience wit .243.

I have yet to see one that wont shoot 85gr sierras. mine and afew others like H4831sc. I pesonally wont use this bullet on deer,but many do. just had a bad experiance, dont want to start an arguement.

I had a 700 varmint special in 243 that would routinely give me 3/8" groups with the 70gr and 85gr Sierra HPBT's using IMR-4320. My very best group was with the 85gr and R-11. The burn rate of R-11 and 4320 are very close.

I'm assuming that you get decent groups with factory fodder, and do all the traditional stuff, like using one brand of brass, clean primer pockets, uniforn the flash hole, etc., so I'll get to a couple things I have found that would give me flyers.

Case length . It doesn't have to be perfect, but the all do need to be uniform.
Neck thickness: 243 cases seem to "grow" and get thicker in the neck after several firings. Don't mix your brass, or get a neck turning tool.
Sizing: smoke a case, and adjust your die so it just comes to the bottom of the case neck. Many 243 dies will set the shoulder back, if just a smidgen, and that's enough to cause accuracy problems.

If none of this improves your groups, I would try anoother set or even brand of dies.

Let us know how you would make out.

Is it a scoped rifle? I once bought a 7mm rem mag which wouldnt shoot within 6 inches of its last shot. It turned out that the joker who mounted the scope shimmed the mounts with cardboard. The scope felt like it was well mounted to the touch but the recoil of the gun would move it all over the place for the next shot. How well is your scope monted? Maybe try that before blaming the gun

I loaded 100gr sierra bullets for a 788 rem using ball c2,imr 4831 and imr 4895 all would print in a cloverleaf at 100 yds.Get the Nosler Reloading Guide 5th edition.

quote:

Originally posted by Belini:
Is it a scoped rifle? I once bought a 7mm rem mag which wouldnt shoot within 6 inches of its last shot. It turned out that the joker who mounted the scope shimmed the mounts with cardboard. The scope felt like it was well mounted to the touch but the recoil of the gun would move it all over the place for the next shot. How well is your scope monted? Maybe try that before blaming the gun

You guys seem to be missing the fact that this has now taken place with 3 diffrent rifles

Did you use the same lot of brass?

Diffrent brass diffrent brands.

You do realize that boattail bullets over 90 grains need a special fast twist rifling, like 1 turn in 8", right? Factory rifles only have a 10" or 9 1/2" twist, too slow to stabilize the longer bullets.

Try H4350 with bullets 80-100 grains.

oh yeah......Lapua brass.

quote:

Originally posted by xs headspace:
You do realize that boattail bullets over 90 grains need a special fast twist rifling, like 1 turn in 8", right? Factory rifles only have a 10" or 9 1/2" twist, too slow to stabilize the longer bullets.

I've had very good luck with 100gr Nozler Partitions in my Sako Forrester.
Also Hornady SSTs.
Sako used a 1in10 twist on this model.

I believe the Sierra 107 and other long bearing surface match bullets require tighter than 1 in 10 .

Of course the twist designated by the factory is not always what you wind up with.

One of my AR15s has a 1in9 twist and shoots Sierra 77s into very small groups.
Actually measured the twist rate and it was 1in8.2.

Might be worth checking your actual twist rate.


Covey16

Krochus:

I had the same problem with a earliy vintage Remington model 7. It turned out it had a 1:12 twist barrel. I trued the action, rebarreled with a Broughton 20" 1:8 5C. Swift 90 grain Shiroccos, 85 grain Barnes TX, and Nosler Accubond and Nosler partitions all shoot sub MOA now.
Rustystud

Sounds like a good opportunity to do a "time out" and check everything over on the gun. Maybe reseat the scope, clean it out from buttplate to muzzle and everywhere in between. Then try some factory loads that should match your rate of twist.

Then to the handloads. If you have anyone with a concentricity guage you may want to see if your seating dies are putting the bullet in straight. If you have access to a chronograph, try that to see if the loads are consistent in muzzle velocity.

Maybe you already tried this all, maybe not. If all else fails, there's still the "Classifieds" section. Good luck.

As others have mentioned....

If I start with a bullet that works with my barrel twist rate, everything else falls into place.
Ir you have a "problem rifle" you may have to iron out the kinks before you get the results you want.

If the rifle shhots factory well I would say the barrel is fine. There is something you are not doing or one part of the recipe that is not right.

I had a very simular problem with a 22-250. It shot factory great and my reloads sucked. It finally bloiled down to bullet depth. I copied factory bullet depth and then went slightly shorter. It worked and got my reloads to work justas good as factory or better.

Some of these were same loads I had tried before it just was bullet depth. By changed a few thousanths of an inch made a huge difference. Most of my guns like on on or just off the lands. This is my only rifle that likes it far off the lands.

Too many things point to your process, If those loads won't shoot in three different rifles. Been reloading since 1963 and have never seen that type of problem. Most of the problems I've had were related to my mistakes. Check anad re-check. Good luck. smoker

I have handloaded for a lot of different rifles, both mine and those of friends. Over the last 20+ years, the only rifle that ever gave me a fit was a Remington Model 7 in .243. The man wanted to shoot 100-grain bullets, and I tried everything: de-burring flash holes, partial length re-sizing, adjusting seating depth, even using faster burning powders due to the shorter barrel. Nothing worked. It shot "smiley faces" at 100, and inconsistently at that.

He finally gave up on that rifle, and went to a .270 H&R. (If Remington knew about that, I suspect they would want the firearm back...)

Many many 243s will not be accurate with 100gr bullets......

I shot 95 grain nosler bt and part. in front of a max LISTED charge (safe in my rifle) of IMR 7828. It is smoker and highly accurate. .5" groups when seated .010" off lands.

The .243 can be a finiky beast, especialy the 99. I would recomend small base dies as the 99's tend toward tight chambers, also get a Lee Factory crimp die and use a bullet with a cannalure as leaver actions tend to be more violent in their cycling than a bolt. As mentioned above find a factory load that shoots and use the same O.A.L. If all of the above fail find someone like me that loves the 99 and sell it to him.