I have a Ruger Blackhawk in 45 LC and as I don't have a 45 Auto conversion cylinder, I can't use 45 Auto Rim because of the rim thickness....my question is...If I was to trim back 45 LC cases so that the internal capacity was the same as the 45 Auto, would this work ??
Not sure if this goes here or Pistols but we'll see what happens...

Roger

quote:

Originally posted by yumastepside:
I have a Ruger Blackhawk in 45 LC and as I don't have a 45 Auto conversion cylinder, I can't use 45 Auto Rim because of the rim thickness....my question is...If I was to trim back 45 LC cases so that the internal capacity was the same as the 45 Auto, would this work ??
Not sure if this goes here or Pistols but we'll see what happens...

Roger

When I owned a 455 Webley revolver I used to trim back 45LC cases to the same length as 45 Auto cases and thin the rims to fit the Webley. Although I didn't load to 45 Auto level I did load 45cal Win 185grSWC, Speer 200grHP, Hornady 250grHP and Lyman Cast 250grRN bullets. They all performed well as I imagine the same trimmed cases would in your Blackhawk. Here's loads for the Webley based on trimmed Federal 45LC cases;

Here is a good article that well help you.

https://gunsmagazine.com/ammo/the-cowboy-45-special/

Think i Got a dozen auto rim case . Two of us have the duel cylinder ruger . I'll give it a try, but didn't be in a rush.

I don’t know much about pistol reloading.

But would think no matter what parent case you make your brass from, if they fit, they should work!

I do believe it would work, but what's the point?
Why not just "light load" the 45 Colt.

quote:

Originally posted by rcraig:
I do believe it would work, but what's the point?
Why not just "light load" the 45 Colt.

Sometimes, some of us just like to try something different!

quote:

Originally posted by rcraig:
I do believe it would work, but what's the point?
Why not just "light load" the 45 Colt.

The Guns Magazine article in the link p dog has posted above explains the reasoning behind using shorter, smaller capacity cases for lighter loads in the 45LC. Similarly the cartridges for the Webley revolvers did the same, the original MK1 cartridge loaded with black powder was shortened slightly (MK11) to obtain better efficiency with the change to nitro powder.
Small charges of powder rattling around in big cases is not generally conducive to efficiency and performance.

I've loaded and fired 100s of 45 Colt "reduced/light" loads. Nary a problem.

Reduced efficiency probably means that the government arsenal can use 0.1 grains less powder, 25-50 grains less brass, weight savings per cartridge… which adds up when you order ammo by the million count, but for us lesser mortals it’s no difference.

As to improved accuracy, I can’t say I can tell the difference between a standard loaded .45 Colt and a CAS bunny fart load accuracy wise…. If it does what you want, it’s good.

Yes, the chronograph SD variation is typically higher with low density loadings, but a revolver isnt typically a platform that makes it obvious at short range.

What crbutler said.

Trimming back the case to .45 ACP length also makes the jump from case mouth to forcing cone just that much longer -- something that can't contribute to accuracy. Just load your .45 Colt cases with .45 ACP loads if you want .45 ACP performance. It will shoot more accurately than you can hold a three-pound handgun with your arms stretched out and bobbing in the wind.

Why not just purchase 45 Schofield brass? Lyman manual has load data.

Won't work. At least in a Ruger 45LC. The rim thickness of a 45 Auto Rimmed is too thick. Cylinder won't turn. I'll get my buddy to try one in his Uberti 45LC. Who knows , maybe a Colt is sloppier. :-)

From my point of view, using shorter cases is pointless.

But if I really want, why not to lathe turn rims a little bit out. Of course from the front of the case, not from the back (because of primer pocked).

Jiri

My 45 LC Blackhawk will shoot rimless ACP ammo as is. The taper must hold them in proper place.

The OP already knows that 45 auto rim cases won't fit because of the thicker rim, he was asking about shortening 45 LC cases down to 45 auto length. Shorter LC cases will of course fit a LC cylinder.

Case walls may get thicker trimming back 45 LC cases

Thanks to all who contributed to this thread...Jiri, its a hell of a lot easier to trim back a case to length than machine the underside of a rim.
My concern with using shortened cases was not so much if they would fit but if there would be any problems in regards to pressure, etc.
I have now found out that the Australian importer of Starline brass does not bring in the Cowboy 45 Special, so it looks like I'll have to cut down my 45LC brass anyway....

Have you tried 45 Cowboy Special brass from Starline? Same thickness rim or slightly smaller than 45 Colt brass and same length as .45 acp brass. I use it in my 45 acp Taurus revolver so I don't have to bother with the star clips..

Steve...........

I don’t understand the question.

The only reason for the creation of the .45 Auto Rim cartridge was to make it possible to shoot factory-made ammunition in a .45 ACP caliber revolver without the use of half-moon clips.

The Auto Rim's rim is too thick to shoot in a 45 Colt cylinder. The Auto Rim was made thicker to take up the space of the 45 acp rim and half moon or full moon clips to give proper headspace in cylinders cut for 45 acp and clips. If he doesn't want to use 45 Colt brass probably be to find some 45 Cowboy Special brass, it works fine in my 45 Colt pistols (2 Blackhawks, 1 S&W and 2 Uberti's) when I tried them for s*&% and grins. I rarely use my 45 acp cylinder in my Blackhawks. I primarily use the 45 Cowboy Special brass in my 6 inch 45 acp Taurus revolver which they work great in for some reason.

Steve..........

quote:

Originally posted by Michael Robinson:
I don’t understand the question.

The only reason for the creation of the .45 Auto Rim cartridge was to make it possible to shoot factory-made ammunition in a .45 ACP caliber revolver without the use of half-moon clips.

The OP is wanting to have the option of using full power 45LC loads or 45ACP power loads, via shortened 45LC cases, in his Ruger Blackhawk without the need to change cylinders. Not so dissimilar to shooting 38 Special in a 357 Magnum or 32 Short in a 32 Long revolver.

One can argue why not just load down the long case version of the cartridges to the short case version performance level; while that argument has some logic, some do like to tinker about with ideas.

agree it's his Saturday and his fingers..
enjoy the squeak,squeak,squeak.

Without sounding rude...if you read my opening statement...I don't have an ACP cylinder and in my last comment...Starline Cowboy 45 Special brass is not available in Australia.
From what I've read there is some merit in ACP length 45 LC brass, including telling light loads from full...

Roger

Ah, I see.

If you can find some, you may be able to use .455 Eley, a/k/a .455 Webley Mk II, cases for your reduced loads.

quote:

Originally posted by Michael Robinson:
Ah, I see.

If you can find some, you may be able to use .455 Eley, a/k/a .455 Webley Mk II, cases for your reduced loads.

No that won't work as 455 Webley cases have a thinner rim than 45LC cases. My first post above relates how I trimmed back and thinned the rims on 45LC cases to make cases for my 455 Webley revolver. You can see the noticeably thin rims on the loaded cartridges in the accompanying image.

I made up a couple of hundred of these shortened thin rim cases for my Webley from new 45LC Federal cases. A simple job on my lathe.

Some .455 ammunition will work quite reliably in some .45 Colt chambered revolvers.

I know this from personal experience.

That’s why I suggested that it may be worth a try.

Again, why create more bullet jump between the case mouth and forcing cone with shorter brass? The full-length brass will work just as well with any load that you might use in shorter brass, and the bullet jump will be much shorter, which typically will help, not hurt, accuracy.

So, what is the point of using shorter brass?

quote:

Originally posted by Michael Robinson:
Some .455 ammunition will work quite reliably in some .45 Colt chambered revolvers.

I know this from personal experience.

That’s why I suggested that it may be worth a try.

.455 ammo will chamber and probably work in 45LC revolvers although due to the thinner rim on the 455 Webley cases headspace will be out of spec. The Webley cartridge is loaded to significantly lower pressure than 45LC or 45ACP so excessive headspace won't likely cause any problems.
The issue is that 455 Webley ammo or cases are scarce and expensive, I think only Fiocchi load 455 Webley ammo these days.

A little time shortening common 45LC cases is still the best option for the OP wanting to pursue a short case.