23 August 2004, 05:29
bwanamrmRe: Problems ahead:
ALF,
That is really dissapointing to hear. I have many good friends from the RSA who have owned their land for generations and I certainly consider them "African". Most continents and nations have had people come in and move the indigenous people out of their ancestral home lands. It happened throughout history. Austrailia and the aborigines, North America and our Native Americans. (that means Canada as well as the USA) All manner of peoples in Europe in the Middle Ages. The redistribution of land argument could get real sticky. Who did the Zulu defeat to increase their holdings etc.???? Will black Africans of one tribe have to give up property to other black African tribes they took it from??? Interesting conundrum!
23 August 2004, 09:33
D HunterOops, the black africans will have to give up most of southern africa to the San bushman tribes if that is to be carried out correctly. "D"
24 August 2004, 02:01
arkypeteWhy not give the blacks back their land, just the way it was before the whites arrived? Destroy the buildings and infrastructure. Cut down or bulldose the fruit trees, etc. Blast all the dams and water impoundments, scorched earth.
I doubt the blacks would have any interest in rebuilding.
Jim
16 October 2006, 00:49
kayakerquote:
BTW my nephew Shawn goes to Stanford College which is near that district, it's location is a wonderful area in the mountains just near the lake, you will know the college well I presume.
Balla, off topic slightly, I know some folks who teach there, wonderful school with great programmes and outlook!
I am intensely interested in this whole land claims issue..it is so woven into elements of politics, culture, environmental risk, economics, its a helluva convoluted thing! I hope to dedicate some time to it as a research interest begenning next year (depending on some stuff) and try publish something on whats going on, not in black and white (excuse the pun!) but in terms the why's and what for's and how people see the outcomes...
There have been some that have been or are potentially going be protected areas/conservancies (re: hunting land). There just such an example in the KZN Midlands (small) and one apparently on the cards in Northern KZN...
I feel if this going to happen, we need to try guide it right from the beginning...
I would like to see what some people like the Childs brothers (CAMPFIRE guys) think of this...
Cheers
16 October 2006, 03:00
500grainsquote:
Originally posted by DanEP:
IN the US, the issue of reparations usually has far less to do with land than it has to do with going after corporations who made money from trade powered by slavery -- which includes banks that bankrolled the textiles and other industrial developments that depended on Southern Agriculture.
I am surprised that you would even acknowledge the reparations issue. Slavery ended 141 years ago. No one who benefited from it is alive today. No one who endured it is alive today. Time to get over it.
Reparation is just another bogus welfare handout scheme.
16 October 2006, 07:09
lawndartquote:
Why not give the blacks back their land, just the way it was before the whites arrived? Destroy the buildings and infrastructure. Cut down or bulldose the fruit trees, etc. Blast all the dams and water impoundments, scorched earth.
I doubt the blacks would have any interest in rebuilding.
Jim
No need to put out any effort to destroy things. The new "owners" will do that on their own.
LD
16 October 2006, 08:03
NitroXquote:
Originally posted by Balla Balla:
MY brothers (owner operated private farm/ranch) in that general local regional area of Limpopo the Province on the (tropic of capricorn) was/has now been formally SOLD back to the government.
They offered my bother a price which he duly accepted so he now (still owns all the animals) and he will give the ranch to the new land claim owners sometime before MID 2007.
Peter,
Is this the same farm you were advertising on AR for sale to members here, hunters etc?
Knowing there was a claim on it?
16 October 2006, 08:19
BwanaBobquote:
Most continents and nations have had people come in and move the indigenous people out of their ancestral home lands.
Too true, in fact I suspect that there may not be any land that is inhabited by the orginal inhabitants - anywhere!
And how far back do we take it? Perhaps land ownership in Europe should be handed over to a trust to manage until the rightful owner, of Neanderthal descent, comes to claim it?
16 October 2006, 11:43
Balla Ballaquote:
Originally posted by NitroX:
Peter,
Is this the same farm you were advertising on AR for sale to members here, hunters etc?
Knowing there was a claim on it?
NitroX
YES that is the same ranch .... BUT we only advertised it on the open market prior to it being (formally gazetted) as a land claim.
What you & others need to be aware of is that there are a (multitude of claims) on many many ranches throughout SA and also rumours of claims BUT until it is formally gazetted and a letter is received it is open game for purchase by anyone.
Sometimes it takes years for claimants to prove their case in COURT and MANY have NOT proved their case and their (pre-claim testing the waters) has been thrown out of court, therefore the ranch becomes totally free from future claims, and open for sale again, so it is a tightrope sometimes to judge. Each case has to be taken on merit and with patience
The best policy to follow is to ignore the rumours of claims UNTIL the actual (letter arrives in the mail) that is how we operated and will do so in future instances should they occur again on the other ranch. That policy works well, unless someone can offer me some other better ideas on how to approach it
Dont worry, everyone interested and enquiring about a ranch purchase in SA ALWAYS asks me and others alike the same question (is there a claim) and they get the bona fide same answer as I have outlined above
All questions welcome
Cheers, Peter
