Anybody encounter this as an add-on cost in a safari camp?

Nope…with the economical, reliability availability of Starlink, this should be a thing of the past. Or another revenue stream for the outfitter, I’m sure they make use of the WiFi, too.

Starlink does not provide services to all the African hunting destinations and those countries which are not subscribed are utilizing other links.

I guess some outfitter might apply a charge for a WiFi while most others don't and those that do will tell you it cost a shitload of money to set up the system.

In Today’s day and age is unacceptable

Starlink has changed the game where it is available. And direct cell to satellite with low earth Starlink and other satellite systems will make satellite phones obsolete in the next few years.

But if an operator doesn’t have unlimited data and you want to watch Instagram videos for two hours a day it’s reasonable to pay. No different than the reasonable consumption caveat for alcohol.

quote:

Originally posted by vvreddy:
Starlink has changed the game where it is available. And direct cell to satellite with low earth Starlink and other satellite systems will make satellite phones obsolete in the next few years.

But if an operator doesn’t have unlimited data and you want to watch Instagram videos for two hours a day it’s reasonable to pay. No different than the reasonable consumption caveat for alcohol.

That sounds absolutely right. Not sure why someone would be insistent on having WiFi in camp anyway. One of the objectives of going on these trips is getting away from the tentacles of technology.

quote:

Originally posted by MJines:

quote:

Originally posted by vvreddy:
Starlink has changed the game where it is available. And direct cell to satellite with low earth Starlink and other satellite systems will make satellite phones obsolete in the next few years.

But if an operator doesn’t have unlimited data and you want to watch Instagram videos for two hours a day it’s reasonable to pay. No different than the reasonable consumption caveat for alcohol.

That sounds absolutely right. Not sure why someone would be insistent on having WiFi in camp anyway. One of the objectives of going on these trips is getting away from the tentacles of technology.

WiFi in camps today is more of a commodity to the operator than is to the client as it makes communications cheaper and far more effective.

In the early days all camps had to rely on HF radios for maintaining contact with their bases/HQs which had regulated/fixed switch-on times
and often had to be aborted due to poor reception.

Enter the satellite phone era which was all good and well but the cost of a call per minute was and still is (unless sat to sat) pretty steep and therefore not used for small talk.

By comparison WiFi is dirt cheap and an unlimited subscription giving 20Mbps costs less than $30 per month in this part of the world.
If an operator cannot throw that cost into the package then what can I say.

Starlink is not legal in Tanzania I think.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Starlink is not legal in Tanzania I think.

Correct.

It is not installed as the deal did not go through though available in Kenya.

quote:

Originally posted by fulvio:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Starlink is not legal in Tanzania I think.

Correct.

It is not installed as the deal did not go through though available in Kenya.

Ive wondered about this…
Doesn’t it really mean you can’t “buy Starlink” in that Country or would it actually not work if you took your own?
The new/small Starlink device is the size of a laptop.
I believe these “disputes” are about royalties from the subscriptions being paid to the Governments (I.e. Tanzania)

quote:

Originally posted by Kpoynter:

quote:

Originally posted by fulvio:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Starlink is not legal in Tanzania I think.

Correct.

It is not installed as the deal did not go through though available in Kenya.

Ive wondered about this…
Doesn’t it really mean you can’t “buy Starlink” in that Country or would it actually not work if you took your own?
The new/small Starlink device is the size of a laptop.
I believe these “disputes” are about royalties from the subscriptions being paid to the Governments (I.e. Tanzania)

From what I know there is no Starlink service available in Tanzania, even if you bring your own device.
And the disputes are more to do with management rights.

quote:

Originally posted by Kpoynter:

quote:

Originally posted by fulvio:

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Starlink is not legal in Tanzania I think.

Correct.

It is not installed as the deal did not go through though available in Kenya.

Ive wondered about this…
Doesn’t it really mean you can’t “buy Starlink” in that Country or would it actually not work if you took your own?
The new/small Starlink device is the size of a laptop.
I believe these “disputes” are about royalties from the subscriptions being paid to the Governments (I.e. Tanzania)

It is not legal in Uganda. Regardless, they had it in one camp.

From what I understand about Starlink, you can use it temporarily in a location it is not licensed for.

But not on a permanent basis.

I agree with Mike and Fulvio. First, I go to Africa to get away from all the yapping dog plaintiff's lawyers I have to deal with, so I didn't like it a bit when they started having Wifi in camp. I was in Masailand in 2017 and that was particularly brutal as we had Wifi and cell service in camp. I got on the phone as soon as we got back to camp, which varied, but I cut everyone off at 12:00 midnight and then the baboons woke me up at 1:00, tea arrived at 6:00 and I spent two hours on the phone in the morning. I was exhausted at the end of my "vacation".

Western Tanzania is a different story. No cell service. For years, I've been offered, but always refused one of the firm's sat phones. Wifi in Western Tanzania is hit and miss in my experience. I wish it was more miss than hit, or preferably non-existent.

This year, I'll be hunting in the Toabora region and I'm concerned it will be more like Masailand than southwestern Tanzania.

Tabora

I have a very large ADR practice mainly Arbitrations. I have to have WiFi anywhere I go. No WiFi no go. I only have to listen to yapping lawyers on days that I am sitting or mediating.

Feels like a BS charge to me, since I'd think the outfitter/PH would be using the wifi whether or not I agreed to pay for it...

But agree, I don't really want it. I have, however, used it to text home every few days while on safari.

Even on the 4 and 5 Star All Inclusive cruise ships, you are given limited wifi access for two devices, and in 90 days, 40 minutes on the Satellite phone. All the rest is an add on.
Some people do carry thier own SatPhones and StarLink dishes and make thier own service. Getting pretty cheap, and easy to carry!!

Nope and I'd be tempted to tell outfitters they have to give me a discount if they have WiFi.
My firm has Sat phones and for years wanted me to carry one when I was in Africa so they could stay in touch and bother me. I always refused. Now with Wifi in camp, it can't be avoided. But I damn sure aren't going to pay for it.

From what I have been able to determine, I believe the charge is applied, at least by some outfitters, when the client must have wi-fi while in any particular camp, but the outfitter does not normally have it set up in that camp, and so would not otherwise provide it.

Might be an idea to NOT make a blanket judgement on this.

In certain areas and camps, it is easy to set up wife today.

In others, it requires a lot of expenses.

In remote areas, the camp needs to buy or hire a dish and its required equipment, have to fly in or drive an engineer to set it up, and the price of data packages is not cheap.

In past years we used to take our own satellite modem, which costs a lot of money, and the service was not that reliable either.

Now we have a dish installed in camp, very reliable service, and much cheaper than having our own modem.

We gladly pay for it.

Saeed,

totally understand, but I go to Africa to get away.

And it's good for my young partners. They can handle it, but if I'm always a backstop, they wont figure that out. I trained them and they need to do it on their own.

You pay a daily rate for hunting and that is it. I have a client discussing the quality of Whiskey in camp and it might cost us an extra fifty bucks a day. It's a bit like gun hire and ammunition. It's all-inclusive and to charge for add-ons is ridiculous considering the cost of a safari.

I distinctly remember one particular outfitter, once awarded "PH of the Year", charging clients for bottled water.

quote:

Originally posted by fulvio:
I distinctly remember one particular outfitter, once awarded "PH of the Year", charging clients for bottled water.

Don't blame him.

He has to pay for his "votes"

We need a certain level of contact while hunting for business. In the not so distant past we would take a BGAN unit, not very satisfactory. Starlink and the othe services have changed all of that and Jeff Bezos promises great movement in coverage very soon.
We were in one camp where the outfitter installed at our request and expense a small satellite internet system. Another hunter in camp got the password and used up the entire data package the very first day video calling his kids. We weren’t very happy.
So, I can see charging for WiFi in some instances.

quote:

Originally posted by K Evans:
We need a certain level of contact while hunting for business. In the not so distant past we would take a BGAN unit, not very satisfactory. Starlink and the othe services have changed all of that and Jeff Bezos promises great movement in coverage very soon.
We were in one camp where the outfitter installed at our request and expense a small satellite internet system. Another hunter in camp got the password and used up the entire data package the very first day video calling his kids. We weren’t very happy.
So, I can see charging for WiFi in some instances.

You can set different access passwords, and limit bandwidth for some.

quote:

Originally posted by fulvio:
I distinctly remember one particular outfitter, once awarded "PH of the Year", charging clients for bottled water.

Yes..no longer in business. At the end of my safari, I was presented with a bag full of bottle caps and charged.

quote:

Originally posted by Brec:

quote:

Originally posted by fulvio:
I distinctly remember one particular outfitter, once awarded "PH of the Year", charging clients for bottled water.

Yes..no longer in business. At the end of my safari, I was presented with a bag full of bottle caps and charged.

I would have told him to FO!

The world is getting too small. When there is no place that is truly remote, there's no point in my going any more. Technology is great to a point, but I'm not generally a fan.

quote:

Originally posted by Saeed:
Might be an idea to NOT make a blanket judgement on this.

In certain areas and camps, it is easy to set up wife today.

In others, it requires a lot of expenses.

In remote areas, the camp needs to buy or hire a dish and its required equipment, have to fly in or drive an engineer to set it up, and the price of data packages is not cheap.

In past years we used to take our own satellite modem, which costs a lot of money, and the service was not that reliable either.

Now we have a dish installed in camp, very reliable service, and much cheaper than having our own modem.

We gladly pay for it.

All things considered, that is precisely my take on this.

Also, I would add that the use of any technology anywhere is a personal choice.

As in, one can choose to use it or not.

Heroin has been readily available in every place I have ever lived.

Yet somehow, I have never used it.

We have had people in camp, who would spend literally HOURS on their sat phones!

One individual asked if he could use mine, I gladly gave it to him, with instructions to use it and then turn the phone off.

Sitting at the dinner table, I heard my phone ring!!??

It was for him as he said he needed to talk to someone who was not available, so he left him a message to call back.

He got up to answer it.

I got up, got the phone and turned it off!

That was the last time he used it!