The Accurate Reloading Forums
Stopping Rifle In Action
26 January 2014, 06:51
WoodHunterStopping Rifle In Action
26 January 2014, 07:13
PSmithIs that the .450 or the .600?
Paul Smith
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DRSS
I had the privilege to fire E. Hemingway's WR .577NE, E. Keith's WR .470NE, & F. Jamieson's WJJ .500 Jeffery
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26 January 2014, 07:43
JefffiveHe's just letting the elephant admire it.
"If you’re innocent why are you taking the Fifth Amendment?”- Donald Trump
26 January 2014, 07:45
Todd WilliamsIn the words of Billy the Kid ... "I'll make you famous"!
26 January 2014, 07:51
jdollari think i would have been holding it with my right hand on the pistol grip and my finger on the trigger guard with the barrel pointed a little more downward
Vote Trump- Putin’s best friend…
To quote a former AND CURRENT Trumpiteer - DUMP TRUMP
26 January 2014, 08:14
N E 450 No2It is the 450 3 1/4".
DOUBLE RIFLE SHOOTERS SOCIETY
26 January 2014, 09:02
bwana cecilWARDROBE! Clean pants & shorts, please.
LORD, let my bullets go where my crosshairs show.
Not all who wander are lost.
NEVER TRUST A FART!!!
Cecil Leonard
26 January 2014, 09:29
Michael RobinsonWhat rifle? There's a rifle in that photo?
Mike
Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer.
26 January 2014, 09:46
georgeldTight pants, uhhh, big ole elephant huh?
So, what was the purpose of this doings?
Wonder if this was just before he/they got stomped into the ground.
Where's the "after" picture now?
George
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George L. Dwight
26 January 2014, 09:54
DCS MemberI may be wrong, but that's Ivan Carter and he's a southpaw. He could get that gun ready in a fraction of a second.
I meant to be DSC Member...bad typing skills.
Marcus Cady
DRSS
26 January 2014, 11:28
ddrhookI'm not an expert like some on this forum. That being said from this one picture . I would say body signs from elephant would suggest mock change. ears are foreword not back as they would be in a full change. trunk in down not curled up as it would be in a full charge. LET the Discourse begin. Also that does appear to be Ivans slightly thinning hair in the picture and he knows enough about elephants to know when to wankum and when to stand your grown and shot them in the toe nails with his little pee shooter.
26 January 2014, 12:43
shakariquote:
Originally posted by ddrhook:
I'm not an expert like some on this forum. That being said from this one picture . I would say body signs from elephant would suggest mock change. ears are foreword not back as they would be in a full change. trunk in down not curled up as it would be in a full charge. LET the Discourse begin. Also that does appear to be Ivans slightly thinning hair in the picture and he knows enough about elephants to know when to wankum and when to stand your grown and shot them in the toe nails with his little pee shooter.
Now if he managed to do that, I REALLY would take my hat off to him!
I think & hope you meant whack 'im my friend! - The term you used is something completely different in English, English!
Gave me a bloody good laugh first thing in the morning though!
26 January 2014, 12:51
freischuetzIrresponsible,stupid stunt!
26 January 2014, 13:13
Saeedquote:
Originally posted by freischuetz:
Irresponsible,stupid stunt!
Precisely!
26 January 2014, 13:17
ddrhookSteve,
your right i did miss spell whackum hahahahahaha.
26 January 2014, 14:26
PondoroHe will be trampeled one day if he keeps doing this show-offs..
26 January 2014, 15:12
SteveGlIf that is, in fact, Ivan Carter, I would be a little bit cautious about criticising anything he does when it comes to elephant.
26 January 2014, 15:23
GOBquote:
Originally posted by Saeed:
quote:
Originally posted by freischuetz:
Irresponsible,stupid stunt!
Precisely!
That is completely stupid, that little stunt goes wrong and someone is toast while dear boy is trying to go bang. Then it is the long sad tears from a dangerous act wrong.
Everyone who has hunted elephant has pretty much learned a bit about how elephants are supposed to react. They generally do in 99.9% of the situations. This guy is one day going to run into an elephant that is really confused about how he is supposed to react and give the old mock charge but turn out to have forgotten he was just playing and kill someone.
I do not want myself or my family around some hero hot dogging it. I have sadly found dead is forever and there is no need to rush that along.
26 January 2014, 15:52
shakariI've gotta say the pic does indeed look irresponsible but that said, Ivan knows elephants & elephant behaviour very well indeed AND there are all kinds of possible scenarios that could well explain how/why the situation wasn't quite as it first appears & the movie industry create scenes that way on a daily basis.
He obviously got away with it because he's still around
& FWIW, I've fairly often got to within a few yards of selected elephants & other DG on foot & with nothing but a camera in my hands so these things are sometimes not as dangerous as might first appear.
26 January 2014, 16:14
arkypeteWhat you don't see is the fellow has peanuts in his left hand and the elephant's trunk is picking them up.
Jim
"Whensoever the General Government assumes undelegated powers, its acts are unauthoritative, void, and of no force." --Thomas Jefferson
26 January 2014, 16:34
michael458quote:
Originally posted by freischuetz:
Irresponsible,stupid stunt!
http://www.b-mriflesandcartridges.com/default.htmlThe New Word is "Non-Conventional", add "Conventional" to the Endangered Species List!
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26 January 2014, 16:38
cal pappasDon't let Saeed see this photo. He hates Hollwood showmanship.
Cal
_______________________________
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26 January 2014, 16:47
Saeedquote:
Originally posted by cal pappas:
Don't let Saeed see this photo. He hates Hollwood showmanship.
Cal
You are absolutely right Cal.
Only Hollywood showmanship gets people to do this sort of silly acts.
With disastrous results.
26 January 2014, 16:54
Mad DogAwwww...after the clients were gone, Ivan and the bull got together for a beer and a smoke to discuss the photo op......
Mad Dog
26 January 2014, 17:03
shootawayWhat do they say about people who become over confident in themselves?
26 January 2014, 18:08
SevensOh, so that's how you use a double.
26 January 2014, 18:11
GOBThe are a lot of people who knew elephants and are dead. Stupid is as stupid does. Let the guy show boat all he wants as long as it is only he who is in danger.
This guy needs re-trained in dealing with clients safety.
26 January 2014, 18:15
Die Ou JagterIt is a 250-3000 the Elephant didn't know the caliber.
26 January 2014, 18:19
p dog shooterNo matter how well one knows animals or how well they have been trained.
About the time one goes bragging about your skill with them.
They well do something to make you look like you know nothing.
26 January 2014, 18:26
SaeedI have been hunting in Africa for over 30 years.
And I find that there is NOTHING that can be taken for granted when it comes to animals.
Sometimes one things he had seen it all.
Suddenly, up comes an animal with a brand new trick you haven't even dreamed of!
26 January 2014, 18:43
shakariI'm not criticising or supporting Ivan at all because I don't know the circumstances of the pic but before you guys get into full turbo-tongue mode, there's plenty of elephants & places such a scene could be easily re-enacted.
1st example 2nd exampleIncidentally: Abu the elephant after whom Moore's camp is named used to have a party trick where any time he saw a video camera, he'd go roaring up to it at full charge, skid to a halt just before hitting it & then turn & walk away.
I will say the original pic does look irresponsible but my point is there MIGHT be more to it than is first apparent.
26 January 2014, 18:52
GOB26 January 2014, 19:46
Dutch44Ivan is right-handed but left eye dominant. He is introducing us to the "Reverse African Carry". That should be a topic for a new thread.
Shootawary:
I call people who are over-confident, misguided, insane, ride-the-short-bus-to-school, shoot the wrong animal when given correct instructions umpteen times, who, if they knew half as much as they thought the did they would know twice as much as they actually do: "Shootaways" (or Shit-for-brains, Shoot-a-Cow, fill in your own sobriquet, ad nauseum.
Dutch
26 January 2014, 20:12
Biebs"What do you mean, it's only a boxlock"???
26 January 2014, 20:20
Tim ViningLike any creature with good taste, the ele is admiring of a fine double rifle.
Tim
26 January 2014, 21:51
PalmerI hope he does not shoot himself while waving the rifle around like that.
The other three people are interesting. It looks like they are unarmed and trying to hide behind each other - except for the one on the right who looks like he is getting ready to head for a tall tree while the lady seems to be pushing the other two out front.
I'm sure it all turned out fine.
ALLEN W. JOHNSON - DRSS
Into my heart on air that kills
From yon far country blows:
What are those blue remembered hills,
What spires, what farms are those?
That is the land of lost content,
I see it shining plain,
The happy highways where I went
And cannot come again.
A. E. Housman
26 January 2014, 22:22
Venture SouthI think you are all jumping to conclusions here.
The way I read the situation having guided on foot before is this.
1. You are not hunting, you are guiding, and are expected to do anything in your power to diffuse the situation
2. Ivan has been doing this a lot longer and more regularly than any of you so he is reading that animals behaviour, not you
3. He seems to have been trapped in open ground by a cantankerous young bull, notorious for their mock charges but very easy to read
4. The situation has passed its flash point, the young bull has weight firmly placed on three feet and is kicking at the dust with his free front foot showing that he is uncertain and is trying to figure out what they are. No real agression or malice present.
5. Ivan has stopped many a mock charge with the rifle in the air before, in order to "cool things down" his body language has to back down and gradually move his people out the way. I believe that this is what we are witnessing in the picture.
I doubt there is a man in Africa today who has spent more time in recent years studying elephant behaviour than Ivan, I would sooner trust my life to him with nothing but a feather in his hands than any of the trigger happy fools I see calling themselves "big game hunters" as most of them could not tell the difference between a charging elephant and the back of a bus.
You all need to take a step back and realize that this is not a hunting scenario, so a lot of what you think you know does not apply.
One last thing here is that the camera taking the shot is far back from them using a Telephoto lens, that will make the elephant seem far closer to them than it actually is.
Now how about we give Ivan the benefit of the doubt and wait for him to tell us what actually happened before throwing him under the bus, as usually happens when the armchair experts decide to crucify "one of our own".
Specialist Outfitters and Big Game Hounds
An appeaser is one who feeds a crocodile, hoping it will eat him last. - Winston Churchill
26 January 2014, 22:29
shakariquote:
Originally posted by Hunting the Box H:
I think you are all jumping to conclusions here.
The way I read the situation having guided on foot before is this.
1. You are not hunting, you are guiding, and are expected to do anything in your power to diffuse the situation
2. Ivan has been doing this a lot longer and more regularly than any of you so he is reading that animals behaviour, not you
3. He seems to have been trapped in open ground by a cantankerous young bull, notorious for their mock charges but very easy to read
4. The situation has passed its flash point, the young bull has weight firmly placed on three feet and is kicking at the dust with his free front foot showing that he is uncertain and is trying to figure out what they are. No real agression or malice present.
5. Ivan has stopped many a mock charge with the rifle in the air before, in order to "cool things down" his body language has to back down and gradually move his people out the way. I believe that this is what we are witnessing in the picture.
I doubt there is a man in Africa today who has spent more time in recent years studying elephant behaviour than Ivan, I would sooner trust my life to him with nothing but a feather in his hands than any of the trigger happy fools I see calling themselves "big game hunters" as most of them could not tell the difference between a charging elephant and the back of a bus.
You all need to take a step back and realize that this is not a hunting scenario, so a lot of what you think you know does not apply.
One last thing here is that the camera taking the shot is far back from them using a Telephoto lens, that will make the elephant seem far closer to them than it actually is.
Now how about we give Ivan the benefit of the doubt and wait for him to tell us what actually happened before throwing him under the bus, as usually happens when the armchair experts decide to crucify "one of our own".
Well said that man.
26 January 2014, 22:45
butchlocreminds me of the UN. and if you do it again we'll tell you again
26 January 2014, 23:25
WoodHunter"I See Your Pair And Raise You A Double"
