RSA Lion Expose'?

14 May 2010, 22:34

blanco county

quote:
Originally posted by TwoZero:
quote:
Originally posted by blanco county:
Whoever is chosen, that person has to start his/her interview with a strong delineation of the difference between free range sport hunting: licensed, regulated, done by reputable outfitters, done with govt. game scouts on board, and all that, and the shooting of lions, or kudu, or gemsbok, or whatever, in relatively small enclosures. The threshold problem is that the news media and the printed press do not make such distinctions and may not be smart enough to make such distinctions; or may be smart enough to know that not making the distinction allows them to paint with a very broad brush.

This +1

All anti-hunters make no distinction between properly managed hunnting, canned hunting, and poaching.

To them all forms of "hunting" are just different ways of killing animals. And they believe that killing animals is wrong, period.

It's not that they lack the ability to make distinctions, they purposefully refuse to.

If the producer for CBS is anti-hunting, then no matter what anyone does they will make an anti-hunting segment.

That being said, if you refuse to engage then you automatically cede the debate. Yes things will probably be edited six ways from Sunday, but an effort should be made to get an alternate view across.

.

15 May 2010, 07:47

Dr. Mike H.

Always remember the media likes to use the terms hunter and poacher as the same. You will never convince them that the two are not the same. When they go in with this initial bias there is no way you can convince them that any hunting is good for anyone or any animal we are all just bloodthirsty rednecks that are mostly drunks.

15 May 2010, 08:47

Milo Shanghai

This theme probably does not need juicing up but I have to say I have met poachers whose ethics I prefer over some hunters'.

15 May 2010, 09:10

JERSEY BOB

For what it is worth, 60 Minutes did a piece a few months back about the lion population in Kenya, and locals killing them off.

This may be a decent point of departure for explaining conservation, permit hunting of the excess population, etc.

15 May 2010, 09:16

BrettAKSCI

quote:
Originally posted by shakari:
Steve,

You're gonna have to explain that one to me.... I don't know who Jon Stewart is?

He's funny, but other than that you aren't missing anything. I guess I could reasonable be called "the next generation". He's a comedian that has a show where they cherry pick news clips from the media and crack jokes about it for entertainment. He and the show are pretty liberal, so they tend to give the worst side of it to conservatives. Now days they really only have the liberals in charge to work with, so they've had to diversify their jokes to both parties. It's funny and whitty and fine as long as people realize it's just entertainment and not news. Unfortunately some people seem to think it's a real news outlet. It's funny, but I had a converastion with a guy my age today that thought it was a "news source". We agreed to disagree. Unfortunately most of the people my age or younger seem to turn off their brain these days and just take what is given to them. Soap box off.

Brett

DRSS
Life Member SCI
Life Member NRA
Life Member WSF

Rhyme of the Sheep Hunter
May fordings never be too deep, And alders not too thick; May rock slides never be too steep And ridges not too slick.
And may your bullets shoot as swell As Fred Bear's arrow's flew; And may your nose work just as well As Jack O'Connor's too.
May winds be never at your tail When stalking down the steep; May bears be never on your trail When packing out your sheep.
May the hundred pounds upon you Not make you break or trip; And may the plane in which you flew Await you at the strip.
-Seth Peterson

15 May 2010, 09:30

Milo Shanghai

quote:
Originally posted by JERSEY BOB:
For what it is worth, 60 Minutes did a piece a few months back about the lion population in Kenya, and locals killing them off.

This may be a decent point of departure for explaining conservation, permit hunting of the excess population, etc.

The locals in Kenya are killing the lions not because there are excess cats but because there are excess people.

15 May 2010, 20:43

SteveGl

quote:
Originally posted by Brett Adam Barringer:
quote:
Originally posted by shakari:
Steve,

You're gonna have to explain that one to me.... I don't know who Jon Stewart is?

He's funny, but other than that you aren't missing anything. I guess I could reasonable be called "the next generation". He's a comedian that has a show where they cherry pick news clips from the media and crack jokes about it for entertainment. He and the show are pretty liberal, so they tend to give the worst side of it to conservatives. Now days they really only have the liberals in charge to work with, so they've had to diversify their shit dishing to both parties. It's funny and whitty and fine as long as people realize it's just entertainment and not news. Unfortunately some people seem to think it's a real news outlet. It's funny, but I had a converastion with a guy my age today that thought it was a "news source". We agreed to disagree. Unfortunately most of the people my age or younger seem to turn off their brain these days and just take what is given to them. Soap box off.

Brett

Quite a good summation. Stewart is extremely influential amongst the younger set - especially the college kids, and unlike the rest of the liberal media, he does exhibit some small ability to think outside the box. He often has authors on promoting their new books, but "How to Become a Professional Hunter in Africa” might be a little too far outside the box for that crowd. Be fun to watch though.

16 May 2010, 19:07

crane

I think some of you here are delusional. I will bet the producers have the UK tape from years ago featuring the McDonalds. They will take off from there. Like Steve says, NEVER trust these people. They will take our best representative and quote them out of context as per Saeed. It will happen. Too think otherwise is a bad bet. I like my crow medium rare if wrong on this.

Exactly how are we supposed to defend the canned lion industry if the reporter REALLY does his/her research? How are you going to defend feeding pet food to an apex predator to turn loose and shoot when of age? Do any of you think that the "saving the lion" argument will wash with the above? Especially with that audience? Not gonna happen.

16 May 2010, 22:50

404WJJeffery

The Media....

The real test is, if you or someone you know has ever been involved in anything newsworthy, or if the media writes about something you know well, you also know that the stories put out bear little resemblance to actual fact-

Issues are sensationalized, chopped up and packaged to sell more to more eyeballs then the plain old truth would ever attract.

17 May 2010, 02:54

crane

404 is spot on. The agenda will be pursued, facts be damned.

17 May 2010, 08:24

blanco county

[QUOTE]Originally posted by crane:
I think some of you here are delusional. I will bet the producers have the UK tape from years ago featuring the McDonalds. They will take off from there. Like Steve says, NEVER trust these people. They will take our best representative and quote them out of context as per Saeed. It will happen. Too think otherwise is a bad bet. I like my crow medium rare if wrong on this.

Exactly how are we supposed to defend the canned lion industry if the reporter REALLY does his/her research? How are you going to defend feeding pet food to an apex predator to turn loose and shoot when of age? Do any of you think that the "saving the lion" argument will wash with the above? Especially with that audience? Not gonna happen.

The point is snot to defend canned hunts. They are not by any means hunting as the ethical hunting community practices hunting. There is danger in appearing and danger in not appearing and being treated as approving canned hunts. A non-hunter, such as a highly reputable wildlife biologist who understands and respects the role of sport hunting, is the best spokesperson. Such a person also has the least risk of being misquoted or smeared. If hunting has no response, then 60 Minutes will paint hunting and hunters as being inclusive of, and defending, canned hunts.

To respond has significant dangers because the media lies without conscience or remorse. To not answer at all is to be subjected to anything they want to say. Canned hunts need to be abolished and sport hunting is the salvation of wildlife populations. We need to stand up and say that.

17 May 2010, 09:23

BrettAKSCI

quote:
Originally posted by blanco county:
To respond has significant dangers because the media lies without conscience or remorse. To not answer at all is to be subjected to anything they want to say. Canned hunts need to be abolished and sport hunting is the salvation of wildlife populations. We need to stand up and say that.

Good points. I guess I'd rather try and get shafted rather than not try.....and get shafted. I'm really not sure how you can reasonable defend canned lion hunting. You could take a run at it will some of the more well regulated structured operations like Tam Safaris, but I still wouldn't envy the job. The less structured shoots are indefensable in my oppinion.

Brett

17 May 2010, 09:34

Luis L.

Marc - thank you very much for the heads-up on this impending bit for 60 Minutes. Better that we all brace for it and (hopefully) offer up a good representative to combat what will inevitable be a sensationalist piece almost certainly spun against the hunting community. Like you said, very few people or organizations come away from 60 Minutes smelling rosy.

17 May 2010, 15:10

shakari

Personally I don't think hunters should have a presence on the programme at all but if they do I think it should be someone from one of the large hunting organisations who is trained in dealing with the media and trained in the field of African game management and/or zoology rather than just a layman hunter who may or may not have shot a few lions........ That last comment isn't a criticism of anyone it's to illustrate the point that just because someone has umpteen million air miles doesn't mean they're an aviation expert.

I'd also be inclined to make it a requirement that the lion breeders association also have a representative there so that the hunting representative can repeatedly make it clear that there is a very large difference difference between the two and that hunters are against the lion breeding industry.

That would also give the producers someone else cast in a bad light rather than the hunters.

NEVER, EVER TRUST THE MEDIA!

17 May 2010, 18:22

blanco county

Sounds good. Will be hard to do as the media will know that their programmed attack on us is being defeated. Nevertheless, if this can be done, It should be.

I think all our ides are for naught. CBS is not about to allow a balanced presentation and nobody from the world wide hunting community will be welcome.