Looks to me like that picture [of the charging bull] was taken from an elevated position (back of a truck?), hence the higher shot location. If one was on ground level, as one would typically expect when hunting, then the shot should be lower given the angle necessary to reach the brain. It is all about the angles.

Here's a pict of an angry cow Mum that charged us in the Save, taken from the back of the truck (before almost falling out!). Note to me the arches are well defined, and the shot placement would change as the shooters position changed, as well as the elephants.



This curious young bull was standing on higher ground (we were on foot):



This knucklehead charged right after I snapped this picture. Were were a good 30 yards away, but as he came the angles changed quickly (I don't think he saw us, just charged the noise).



Better buy Will's book and Buzz's DVD!

...and afterwards go to the zoo and spend lots of time studying the elephant as they move.

quote:

Originally posted by Pete E:
So, if somebody hit the second wrinkle down, would that miss the brain?

Yes

Ain't this fun?!!

Interesting that you mention going to the zoo. I plan to do exactly that. Believe it or not, there are elephants in the Anchorage zoo.

The DVD from Buzz really made a lot of sense the way he explained angles. I could see the angles changing as the head moved. The wildly angled downhill shot by Dan was one exception. Dan didn't get it right, neither did I or probably anyone else that watched the video. That was really bizarre. How many times would a shot like that occur? Pretty rare I think.

Have a look at these, I have no idea if any of these are correct (having only shot two elephant - both with heart/lung shots). It is amazing to me how precise one has to be on the frontal brain shot. It does appear to me (purely anecdotal evidence) that many inexperienced hunters tend to shoot too high.

Now that you have looked at the photos, here is my best guess. On the first I would pick the lower of the two shots. On the second, I would pick the higher of the two (we seem to be on his same level - as if we are elevated compared to his position). On the third, I think that I might go even a bit lower than the the lowest shot shown - perhaps the bottom of the circle (his head seems to be raised a bit).

This is just my best guess, based on reading books. Anyway, a fun little discussion. Remember, those photos I posted are just starting points for the discussion. I am not saying I am correct in the shot placement.

Regards,

Terry

I was going to say the same thing...the temptation would be to shoot too high. Nervousness would amplify that tendency.

On the first elephant, the second pic is about right.

On the second bull, both are too low.

On the third, it is a bit low.

Bill,
On the third photo, which one (or both) is a bit low (not arguing - just asking as your reply wasn't specific).

Regards,

Terry

Let's look at BillC's photos. Too high, too low or about right??? [Remember you are in the back of the cruiser on the first two photos].

How about the side brain shot????

Lets' see if it is easier to draw a line between where I think the earholes are located????





That is going to rasie my shot compared to the photos with the cirlces. Damn this is hard. Maybe I should just plan on climbing a tree if I am ever charged.

By Bulldog:
Can anyone give me a rough estimate?

Bulldog! A rough estimate can get you killed.

Originally posted by Pete E:
So, if somebody hit the second wrinkle down, would that miss the brain?
PeteE! Yes it would but if well centered it might hit the spine and still stop the charge.

TCarr's pictures:
#1 and 2, I'd go for where the two circles overlap.

#3 and 4, On the upper line of picture #3

#5 and 6 I'd again shoot for where the two circles overlap.

BillC's pictures: Top of line on pic 1 is about right and #2 is way too low.

Picteure 3, move circle down 1/2 a circle. 4 is way too low.

TCarr's side brain shot pics. 1 is too high and 2 is spot on.

TCarr's ear hole lines. 1 is too high , move it down 2 inches.
2 is very close, maybe slightly high.

IMO going a little low is vastly superior than being a little high.

465H&H

quote:

Originally posted by T.Carr:
Bill,
On the third photo, which one (or both) is a bit low (not arguing - just asking as your reply wasn't specific).

Regards,

Terry

Oops. The second pic of the third elephant is about right.

Too many elephants, not enough magazine capacity.

I just got my copy of Ndlovu by Richard Harland. Thumbed through it to the shot placement chapter and I can recommend his descriptions to you all. He shows lots of different angles but remember your not shooting for a place on the near side skin of the elephant but at the well and deeply hidden brain.

465H&H

quote:

Originally posted by 465H&H:
I just got my copy of Ndlovu by Richard Harland. Thumbed through it to the shot placement chapter and I can recommend his descriptions to you all. He shows lots of different angles but remember your not shooting for a place on the near side skin of the elephant but at the well and deeply hidden brain.

465H&H

I hope my wife remembered to order mine!