One gun one planet

15 November 2003, 02:34

JJHACK

One gun one planet

After reading the post put up by Alf regarding the new gun laws in RSA I started to wonder about whats going on in the world. I often read about the very strict gun regulations in Japan, Canada, England, and Austrailia. I remember seeing the front end loader dumping rifles into a big metal shreader in Austrailia. These illegal guns had to be turned in after the laws changed down under. Seems the USA is lucky or has been lucky up til now.

Over the years working in RSA I have loaned my rifles to quite a few hunters who either don't own a rifle or did not want the risk of travelling with their own. Many of my hunters coming from outside the USA don't bring a gun. Most Americans and Canadians do bring their own, but even a few of them have used my "loaner" guns.

Now I guess the question is this, what I would do if I lived in a place where I could only own one rifle? ( I know.... MOVE) But really, what would you choose to keep for a one(firearm) rifle law? I would struggle to decide this because I hunt outside the USA. Since this is the "Africa" forum it should be a choice for the whole planet not just North America.

I would hate to see this happen but if in the future we somehow get screwed and this would come to be THE LAW. I think I would choose the 375HH I own as first choice. If I had to list 3 of the best choices for world wide hunting, they would probably be 375, 338, 30/06 or 300Mag. Hmmm what a brutal situation that would be! I suppose the 300 mag or 338 might be the best all around choice because you could probably borrow a big bore for the few special species needing one in Africa. However the 375HH could handle anything and is still a decent 300 plus yard rifle. Kinda heavy to pack around for general bag North American hunting Though. Just for the few visits out side the country.

Lets hope this never happens here. Make sure you never take the additute that gun ownership will always be guaranteed. In those other countries mentioned The majority of folks I speak with say the same exact thing. "We did not take the anti gun people serious". Or this one is good as well; " I just figured there were organisations fighting this for us so I did not do anything to help save our gun rights".

I think too many people believe there are other guys saving gun rights, or somebody else is worrying about it and taking care of it. This is a big mistake when you speak to the others who have lost the rights already.

Don't assume it's going to be alright and become complacent. DO SOMETHING to help yourself and everyone else. Join the NRA and SCI they are likely the groups that will ultimately allow us to keep our hunting lifestyle what it is today. Maybe you don't believe in everything they stand for but they are the two best insurance policies we have in the USA right now.

15 November 2003, 03:06

TXPO

I would have to agree...my .375 H&H would be my first choice under those brutal and frightening circumstances.

15 November 2003, 03:16

Blacktailer

JJ,
My choice for hunting would be the 375. I love it. However, at the risk of being branded as a gun loving kook (aren't we all?) I might opt for something to take out the stormtroopers (jack booted thugs) as they try to come thru my front door to try and take my guns. The first ammendment is our first defense against tyranny, the second ammendment is our last. Politicians understand two things- votes and money. If we are not all members of SCI and NRA we will have only ourselves to blame.

15 November 2003, 03:17

Fjold

I think the 375 H&H is the only choice. World wide popularity and ammunition availabilty comes to mind.

15 November 2003, 03:33

mbogo375

quote:
Originally posted by JJHACK:

Now I guess the question is this, what I would do if I lived in a place where I could only own one rifle? ( I know.... MOVE) But really, what would you choose to keep for a one(firearm) rifle law? I would struggle to decide this because I hunt outside the USA. Since this is the "Africa" forum it should be a choice for the whole planet not just North America.

JJ,

This is a nightmare scenario, but not out of the question in the current political climate. As a serious answer to your question I would certainly pick a 375 H&H.

As a way around the problem I would keep my "politically incorrect" Blaser R93 with barrels in 375 H&H, 270 Win, 300 RUM, and 416 Rem (and 22-250 or 223 if I wanted a varmint caliber). It would not be as pleasing to the eye as my Jeffery 375, or as satifying to shoot as my W-R 450/400 double, but it would cover all the hunting possibilities that I would ever have to deal with.

Jim

15 November 2003, 04:14

Jim in Idaho

This would be a tough one. I surely love the .375 H&H, it really hammersï¿½em!

But ï¿½ after giving this a bit of thought, my choice would be a .30-06. It will cover all but about 10% of what the .375 would be used for, and one really needs to think about the 90%.

Considering the entire planet, how often do we hunt Cape Buffalo or elephant or lion or really big bears versus hunting coyotes, dik-dik, deer, elk, red stag, black bear, antelope, impala, caribou, sheep, moose, kudu, blesbok, New Zealand thar, reedbuck, eland, zebra, warthog, so on and so forth? Load up some 125ï¿½s at 3100 fps plus for coyotes or antelope, 165 or 180 grain A-Frames or Xï¿½s to cover everything from dik-dik to moose, and stuff a 200 grain premium in the spout and go shoot an eland or a lion (okay, that takes balls or lack of brains or both), or a big bear ï¿½ the .30-06 was commonly used for grizzlies in the twenties through the fifties and even later, and we have much better, deeper penetrating bullets these days. Besides, your guide will have his ï¿½oneï¿½ gun, so make sure your guide carries the .375. In Africa a .30-06 with a fast opening 150 grain bullet is probably as good if not a better choice for leopard, at least based on what Iï¿½ve read about leopard hunting. I know the .375 is extremely versatile (thatï¿½s why I have two) and would definitely be the choice for the bigger game, but again the idea is to get a rifle more nearly perfect for the 90% and that could still make-do for at least half of the remaing 10%.

The .300 or .338 Magnums are good all arounders as well, but the foundation of my hunting strategy is defined in my tag line ï¿½ gunnery, gunnery, gunnery ï¿½ hit the target! I can just shoot a .30-06 more than the other rounds without fatigue, this allows me to fire more rounds in practice.

If all I did was hunt buffalo in Africa or grizzly in Alaska then the .375 would definitely get the nod, but considering that the vast majority of time, for an African or Aussie or European or American or any place in between, is spent in search of more medium sized game, the old ï¿½06 would still the best answer for me.

15 November 2003, 04:26

Oldsarge

I still stand by my original signature. Being a teacher by trade and living, as I do, in a major metropolitan area, "normal" hunting is just out of the picture. The only time I have any chance is the months of July and August with one week around the first of the year and one after Easter. Basically, this restricts me to the arctic and south of the equator. Unlike the vast majority of the brethren, I don't hunt deer most of the time so being prepared for the biggest of the big is the better policy. Besides, Lily Martel is the most accurate thing I own!

15 November 2003, 04:32

fritz454

It's hard to argue with a 375 H&H. That being said I would prefer a 416 rem.

In American, should it ever come to this, remember the ATF considers the rife/gun the action. This doesnï¿½t include the bolt, barrel or magazine. The obvious solution here is to have a switch barrel. One bolt could cover all of the calibers from, if you wanted, .25stw-416rem. You could have a second bolt made and mag box for a 22-250-308 case size and another for .223. Effectively you can have as many calibers as you want with the only draw back being the action length, as it would need to accommodate the longest case you were planning to use. Some sort of easy adjustable bolt stop could be made so you can short stroke the small cases but it is all possible.

I would hope it never comes to this. We all need to support the groups that defend our rights. NRA, SCI. Iï¿½m a life member with both and while I certainly donï¿½t agree with all of what they do it is the best, and only, show in town with enough clout to be effective.

JMHO
John

15 November 2003, 05:08

WPN

I'm with Jim in Idaho on this one, except my choice would be my only rifle already: a custom Echols Model 70 .300 Win Mag.

I would happily take it for brown bear, and if I wanted to hunt Cape Buffalo, I have a friend who will let me borrow his Marcel Thys .375 H&H double rifle.

My present rifle does everything I need, or want. Problem solved.

15 November 2003, 05:24

N E 450 No2

JJHack
That is a very tough question. my answer is baised on a fella that does a lot of hunting in America [where I live] uncluding Alaska, and plans on making many trips to Africa. This choice is also baised on my preference in rifles that I like to hunt with, thus it may not be the best "computer choice" but is my choice. What ever the percieved limitations of my choice is I accept it.
The first choice that comes to mind is my 450/400 3 1/4" British double. 26" bbls 9 1/4 lbs. I have hunted with this rifle in TX, Montana [ on backpack bear hunts] and Alaska. With 300gr .025jkts it has works perfectly on deer and pigs and would do so on similar sized game anywhere. With 400gr Woodleigh's it has done very well on 2 Caribou and a Black Bear. Its effectiveness in Africa is a matter of record.
If it was my only rifle I would have it scoped with a QD mount.
While my 450 No2 is my favorite rifle, it is just too heavy [for mountain hunting] to be my only rifle.

I also must consider my Chapuis 9,3x74R double. This is my all time favorite rifle under 40 cal. I have taken all manner of small game including several coyotes and one bobcat, as well as deer and wild pigs [2 over 300 lbs] and one Black Bear. I have spoken to several African PH's about its use in Africa, all have stated it is excellent for plains game and Cats. The WORST comment I got was "It may be a bit light for buff, but will do the job with good hits". Many PH's asked if it was scoped, as they liked a scoped rifle for the client on Cats.
This 9,3 double only weighs 7 1/4 lbs [without scope] and is a joy to carry, even with the scope. I have backpack hunted with it also.

Both of the above rifles while doubles have proven to be good shooters to 200 yards with left and right bbls. For longer distances if necessary the scope would be sighted in for one bbl. I prefer to hunt and shoot my animals at close range, but the "one and only" rifle should be capable of making kills at 250 to 300 yards.
By chosing the proper bullets for the above two rifles I could use either one as my "only" rifle on any game on the planet. If I had to pass on a 450 yard shot, so be it.

My only problem with the above two rifles is ammo. You just can't find ammo for them in very many places...so

Enter the 375H&H double. I an not a great fan of the 375. I am not a detractor either. I have owned 3 375"s, still own 2. Its reputation "precedes itself". Some say "its too much for deer" , others say "it is not enough for buff or elephant" Jeff Cooper once wrote "Its too much gun for 90% of the game you hunt and not enough gun for the other 10%. [ I think this is a fairly accurate statement, however I would say it is just right for about 10% of the game ie. the Big Bears, Lion, and Eland]. However it is one caliber that with factory ammo can do it all, even out to fairly long range. And most important of all, any where ammo can be found, and big game is hunted you can find 375 H&H.

SO I guess MY "computer analyzed choice" would be a scoped 375 H&H Double Rifle. Make it a Chapuis.
I would just take my chances with any possible rimless case extrations.
One of these days I am going to get a 375 H&H double and extensively test this theory out.

[ 11-14-2003, 20:28: Message edited by: N E 450 No2 ]

15 November 2003, 05:46

Chuck Nelson

Here is what I would do. I would have a 300 win mag built on a LH model 70 action that has had the action fine tuned and the ejection port opened up. This would accomodate all of my needs in North America and if I went to Africa, for dangerous game, I would have a gunsmith install a .375 barrel chambered for the H&H and go.

Chuck

15 November 2003, 05:52

120mm

.22 long rifle

15 November 2003, 06:01

hamdeni

My first rifle I bought was a 300win mag, I had that for two years and I enjoyed shooting and hunting with it. When I bought my second rifle it was a 375 H&H mag and I just felt in love with it. I have had it for two years and is the rifle which enjoy using alot.Now I hardly use the 300win mag. I would go for 375H&H any day.

Hamdeni [Smile]

15 November 2003, 06:02

.375 H&H with 2 zeroed scopes. One for 235 gr speers and the other for heavier bullets, maybe a spare barrel in .300 as another posted suggested the I would have another two scopes for that barrel.

This is not as stupid as it sounds with the fucked Governments we have in Australia and the stinking green groups.

15 November 2003, 06:31

WyoJoe

I am a handloader so I could do different loads for different game. I would have Dakota Arms make me up a switch barrel rifle in .300 H&H and .416 Rem. That could cover the world.

15 November 2003, 06:51

MARK H. YOUNG

I really like all manner of rifles and calibers but if I could only have one it would without doubt be my 375H&H. It shoots a couple of 270gr. bullets at 2750-2800fps and my solids print about 2 in. lower and directly under the the soft points. This combo will work for duiker through elephant. At 8.5 pounds with scope it is a little heavy for mountain hunting but we are talking a compromise gun here. Also if you built a 375 from scratch you could build it at about a pound lighter if you didn't find the recoil to nasty. Of course you could install a muzzle brake but I won't open that can of worms.

15 November 2003, 07:11

MacD37

well folks, I fear, if this happened, the handloading would be a victim of the ruling as well, so one would be limited to factory ammo! If the "action" were the criteria, then make mine a 375 H&H double rifle,with a set of cape barrels, chambered for 20ga 3"/375 H&H,and a set of 20 guage 3" barrels, and with a QD scope for the double rifle, and the cape gun barrels! like 450 nitro, I would just take my chances with a failier to eject!

If the USA turned that tyranical, it would most likely be a better bet to have something that was chambered for the existing military cartridge, so one could always use their ammo to regain our rights! The first amendment gives us the right to say we don't like the way the government acts, and the second amendment gives us the means of inforceing our will, on that government! The war of 1776 was such an enforcement on the British Crown, and though it isn't PC to say, it CAN happen again!

[ 11-15-2003, 05:37: Message edited by: MacD37 ]

15 November 2003, 10:23

N E 450 No2

MacD37
Well said!
Great minds think alike. [Big Grin]

15 November 2003, 10:55

ALF

15 November 2003, 11:13

BFaucett

"Before a standing army can rule, the people must be disarmed; as they are in almost every kingdom in Europe. The supreme power in America cannot enforce unjust laws by the sword; because the whole body of the people are armed, and constitute a force superior to any band of regular troops that can be, on any pretence, raised in the United States. A military force, at the command of Congress, can execute no laws, but such as the people perceive to be just and constitutional; for they will possess the power, and jealousy will instantly inspire the inclination, to resist the execution of a law which appears to them unjust and oppressive."
---Noah Webster, An Examination of the Leading Principles of the Federal Constitution (Philadelphia 1787).
http://www.guncite.com/gc2ndfqu.html

Better make mine 5.56 NATO! [Big Grin]

Seriously, for me it would come down to a choice between the .30-06 and the .375 H&H. Tough call. A lot would depend on what types of game I hunted the most and also where I lived (what continent, region, etc.). As a North American I would probably choose the .30-06. And it would adequately handle a lot of game in other parts of the world.

-Bob F.