Make No Mistake...
We are in a FULL OUT CULTURE WAR folks...
Hunting...
Freedom of Speech..
Gun Rights...
Hell..Gender...
You name it...
The LEFT HATES US...they HATE everything and everyone that doesn't agree with their lunacy.
They hate your Religion...they Hate your culture...
It's time we all fight back on every issue..
Refuse to Apologize...
refuse to back down
Refuse to compromise...
You cannot be soft as this is their Game...Bully..Attack...Boycott...whatever...
You cannot placate the Mob...This is the Religion of the Left

Some of the comments on here is shocking to be honest! as A young Ph starting out in 18 years ago this side was by far my favourite place on the internet not so any more ... but then again my opinion will not matter so have a go at it boys.

The sad thing is that Abercrombie & Fitch is now terrible (well, for a long time). This shit has spread all over.

DSC is promoting many great videos on the Facebook. They feature well known people that we know.

I do think that is “preaching to the choir.”

What is the answer? Collaborate with Hollywood hunters? There are many. The Congressional Sportsman’s Foundation is another.

The advertisements go to us on our channels. The HSUS and the like have free reign.

I’m not sure of an answer, but I know the problem.

Man I can't believe some of you gentlemen. I also know and have shared camps with this hunter and consider him a good friend. Total free range lion, no drugs, ethically hunted. Some of you guys need to stop being judgmental shitheads and armchair experts... ask questions, get the fucking facts before firing off your pieholes.

Now that I have had a chance to rant. We should be civil sporting gentlemen and always hear both sides of the story before castigating other sportsmen and women. We owe it to all involved...

quote:

Originally posted by bwanamrm:
Man I can't believe some of you gentlemen. I also know and have shared camps with this hunter and consider him a good friend. Total free range lion, no drugs, ethically hunted. Some of you guys need to stop being judgmental shitheads and armchair experts... ask questions, get the fucking facts before firing off your pieholes.

Now that I have had a chance to rant. We should be civil sporting gentlemen and always hear both sides of the story before castigating other sportsmen and women. We owe it to all involved...

…………………………WELL SAID FRIEND!


…………………………………………………………..

Yes in the court of public opinion these pictures and videos are very damaging. It is not a good idea to post hunting videos on social media.

quote:

Originally posted by jaegerfrank:
The hunters personal decision. I still think that hunting videos in most cases are very damaging.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/ne...mpaign=1490&ito=1490


They showed up at his house.

This film was actually on an episode of Tracks...

And folks raved about it then.

quote:

Originally posted by bwanamrm:
Man I can't believe some of you gentlemen. I also know and have shared camps with this hunter and consider him a good friend. Total free range lion, no drugs, ethically hunted. Some of you guys need to stop being judgmental shitheads and armchair experts... ask questions, get the fucking facts before firing off your pieholes.

Now that I have had a chance to rant. We should be civil sporting gentlemen and always hear both sides of the story before castigating other sportsmen and women. We owe it to all involved...

Not to defend those who have jumped to conclusions about this hunt... but it appears to me that the film clip has been edited to make the hunt look "unsporting". Just my 2 cents.

quote:

Originally posted by bwanamrm:
This film was actually on an episode of Tracks...

And folks raved about it then.

If this is the case, then the daily mail should have a new owner via defamatory suit.

2011? Previously (copyrighted) footage? This is not “news”.

Context is everything here. Tracking a lion down is one of the hardest things one can do. Kudos to anyone who can pull it off. Walking up on a sleeping wild animal is not easy...

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:

quote:

Originally posted by bwanamrm:
This film was actually on an episode of Tracks...

And folks raved about it then.

If this is the case, then the daily mail should have a new owner via defamatory suit.

2011? Previously (copyrighted) footage? This is not “news”.

Context is everything here. Tracking a lion down is one of the hardest things one can do. Kudos to anyone who can pull it off. Walking up on a sleeping wild animal is not easy...

I have to agree that it would seem to me that The Daily Mail is leaving itself open a lawsuit. In more than one instant the article states that the hunter killed specific animals that are endangered(specifically elephant, rhino, lion and leopard). None of these animals are listed as endangered.

It is my understanding(limited understanding) that print media normally spends a lot of time and energy fact checking their articles to protect themselves from lawsuits.

quote:

Originally posted by crbutler:

quote:

Originally posted by bwanamrm:
This film was actually on an episode of Tracks...
And folks raved about it then.

If this is the case, then the daily mail should have a new owner via defamatory suit.

2011? Previously (copyrighted) footage? This is not “news”.

Context is everything here. Tracking a lion down is one of the hardest things one can do. Kudos to anyone who can pull it off. Walking up on a sleeping wild animal is not easy...

There is no "If" about it. This was an episode of Tracks ...

Sorry, Todd!

My reason for wording it that way is I don’t remember that episode and don’t know when.

quote:

Originally posted by Poyntman:
Make No Mistake...
We are in a FULL OUT CULTURE WAR folks...
Hunting...
Freedom of Speech..
Gun Rights...
Hell..Gender...
You name it...
The LEFT HATES US...they HATE everything and everyone that doesn't agree with their lunacy.
They hate your Religion...they Hate your culture...
It's time we all fight back on every issue..
Refuse to Apologize...
refuse to back down
Refuse to compromise...
You cannot be soft as this is their Game...Bully..Attack...Boycott...whatever...
You cannot placate the Mob...This is the Religion of the Left

+ 1

So many hunters are very willing to sell each other out.

quote:

The LEFT HATES US...they HATE everything and everyone that doesn't agree with their lunacy.
They hate your Religion...they Hate your culture...

While we, of course are paradigms of understanding and accommodation!
I see nothing wrong with raising the question. It certainly showed up on my items of interest when I got on the internet several days ago. There were several questions raised:
Shooting a sleeping animal.
The death throes of a wounded animal.
The compliments of the PH.
All of these would probably be accepted by hunters, but I do NOT hate someone to whom these are foreign. Neither am I going to change my mind because someone on the Internet who I have never met, tells me that he has "shared a campfire" with the hunter in questions and he is a wonderful guy!
The knowledgeable hunters on AR have generally done a good job of policing our own, calling people out when necessary. Surely this is required of the participants of any activity, whether it be hunting or curling!
Hunting standards seem to be a bit higher, because life is being taken without a survival necessity. I will NOT join a "circle the wagons" because someone likes hunting elephant with a machine gun! Sorry!
Just my 2 cents!
Peter

Difference between "calling people out" and not fact checking before jumping to conclusions and even making suppositions on the internet, on a a site that is regularly ghosted by the antis.

Sorry Peter, totally disagree with you. The fact we believed the Daily Mail before one of our own is really unbelievable to me.

This is the old "divide and conquer" strategy the antis play on us and unfortunately on AR it works so well...

Gullible and foolish we sometimes are.

And who in the fuck is hunting elephants with a machine gun? Or has EVER supported that on this site?

No need to join in the circle of wagons Peter. But bashing another hunter because you may not like something is just plain stupid. Some time saying nothing is best and not doing what you may not like can always be your choice.

Guys like you crack me up because one day if we lose are rights to hunt you will be wondering why and still be clueless

quote:

Originally posted by Poyntman:
Make No Mistake...
We are in a FULL OUT CULTURE WAR folks...
Hunting...
Freedom of Speech..
Gun Rights...
Hell..Gender...
You name it...
The LEFT HATES US...they HATE everything and everyone that doesn't agree with their lunacy.
They hate your Religion...they Hate your culture...
It's time we all fight back on every issue..
Refuse to Apologize...
refuse to back down
Refuse to compromise...
You cannot be soft as this is their Game...Bully..Attack...Boycott...whatever...
You cannot placate the Mob...This is the Religion of the Left

Exactly!

I find myself defending what I do more often now than in the past.

Practically everything acceptable by the clueless generation today I find offensive!

quote:

Practically everything acceptable by the clueless generation today I find offensive!

+1

quote:

Originally posted by bwanamrm:
Difference between "calling people out" and not fact checking before jumping to conclusions and even making suppositions on the internet, on a a site that is regularly ghosted by the antis.

Sorry Peter, totally disagree with you. The fact we believed the Daily Mail before one of our own is really unbelievable to me.

This is the old "divide and conquer" strategy the antis play on us and unfortunately on AR it works so well...

Gullible and foolish we sometimes are.

And who in the fuck is hunting elephants with a machine gun? Or has EVER supported that on this site?

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:

quote:

The LEFT HATES US...they HATE everything and everyone that doesn't agree with their lunacy.
They hate your Religion...they Hate your culture...

While we, of course are paradigms of understanding and accommodation!
I see nothing wrong with raising the question. It certainly showed up on my items of interest when I got on the internet several days ago. There were several questions raised:
Shooting a sleeping animal.
The death throes of a wounded animal.
The compliments of the PH.
All of these would probably be accepted by hunters, but I do NOT hate someone to whom these are foreign. Neither am I going to change my mind because someone on the Internet who I have never met, tells me that he has "shared a campfire" with the hunter in questions and he is a wonderful guy!
The knowledgeable hunters on AR have generally done a good job of policing our own, calling people out when necessary. Surely this is required of the participants of any activity, whether it be hunting or curling!
Hunting standards seem to be a bit higher, because life is being taken without a survival necessity. I will NOT join a "circle the wagons" because someone likes hunting elephant with a machine gun! Sorry!
Just my 2 cents!
Peter

So you are willing to believe the antis at face value, but are unwilling to do the same for a fellow hunter? Also, who is machine gunning elephants and who is asking you to support it?

quote:

Originally posted by Lhook7:

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:

quote:

The LEFT HATES US...they HATE everything and everyone that doesn't agree with their lunacy.
They hate your Religion...they Hate your culture...

While we, of course are paradigms of understanding and accommodation!
I see nothing wrong with raising the question. It certainly showed up on my items of interest when I got on the internet several days ago. There were several questions raised:
Shooting a sleeping animal.
The death throes of a wounded animal.
The compliments of the PH.
All of these would probably be accepted by hunters, but I do NOT hate someone to whom these are foreign. Neither am I going to change my mind because someone on the Internet who I have never met, tells me that he has "shared a campfire" with the hunter in questions and he is a wonderful guy!
The knowledgeable hunters on AR have generally done a good job of policing our own, calling people out when necessary. Surely this is required of the participants of any activity, whether it be hunting or curling!
Hunting standards seem to be a bit higher, because life is being taken without a survival necessity. I will NOT join a "circle the wagons" because someone likes hunting elephant with a machine gun! Sorry!
Just my 2 cents!
Peter

So you are willing to believe the antis at face value, but are unwilling to do the same for a fellow hunter? Also, who is machine gunning elephants and who is asking you to support it?

Before we go too far, let me say I have no problem stating my objection to a hunter who does things that are not fair play according to hunting acceptability. However in this case PETER seems to believe hunters are hunting elephants with a machinegun, which is absolutely not true. The machinegun shooters are poachers, not hunters. even semiauto rifles are illegal in every hunting place in Africa that I am aware of. In the article where pictures were posted with the hunter who shot the lion, the picture of that hunter with a white Rhino stating that he was killed, shows the ignorance of the poster of that picture stating that the rhino was "killed" when the hunter is holding a dart gun to put the rhino to sleep so pictures and measurements and vaccinations could be administered before the rhino is released to go on fathering more rhino calves.

All this simply shows the ignorance of the antis and those who take anything they post as gospel. If ignorance was painful, most anti hunting people would be screaming in pain 24 hrs a day!

……………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………... CORRECTION!

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:

quote:

Originally posted by Lhook7:

quote:

Originally posted by Peter:

quote:

The LEFT HATES US...they HATE everything and everyone that doesn't agree with their lunacy.
They hate your Religion...they Hate your culture...

While we, of course are paradigms of understanding and accommodation!
I see nothing wrong with raising the question. It certainly showed up on my items of interest when I got on the internet several days ago. There were several questions raised:
Shooting a sleeping animal.
The death throes of a wounded animal.
The compliments of the PH.
All of these would probably be accepted by hunters, but I do NOT hate someone to whom these are foreign. Neither am I going to change my mind because someone on the Internet who I have never met, tells me that he has "shared a campfire" with the hunter in questions and he is a wonderful guy!
The knowledgeable hunters on AR have generally done a good job of policing our own, calling people out when necessary. Surely this is required of the participants of any activity, whether it be hunting or curling!
Hunting standards seem to be a bit higher, because life is being taken without a survival necessity. I will NOT join a "circle the wagons" because someone likes hunting elephant with a machine gun! Sorry!
Just my 2 cents!
Peter

So you are willing to believe the antis at face value, but are unwilling to do the same for a fellow hunter? Also, who is machine gunning elephants and who is asking you to support it?

Before we go too far, let me say I have no problem stating my objection to a hunter who does things that are not fair play according to hunting acceptability. However in this case Lhook7 seems to believe hunters are hunting elephants with a machinegun, which is absolutely not true. The machinegun shooters are poachers, not hunters. even semiauto rifles are illegal in every hunting place in Africa that I am aware of. In the article where pictures were posted with the hunter who shot the lion, the picture of that hunter with a white Rhino stating that he was killed, shows the ignorance of the poster of that picture stating that the rhino was "killed" when the hunter is holding a dart gun to put the rhino to sleep so pictures and measurements and vaccinations could be administered before the rhino is released to go on fathering more rhino calves.

All this simply shows the ignorance of the antis and those who take anything they post as gospel. If ignorance was painful, most anti hunting people would be screaming in pain 24 hrs a day!

……………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………...

Mac, you've got Lhook7 and Peter mixed up in the above post.

Look folks, we all know there are hunters out there that most of us wouldn't want to associate with. Unfortunately, many hunting shows are chocked full of these types. Pigman, that Chris Bracket fellow, the Busbice family, and the like. Tracks is NOT one of them. The hunter and PH in this video are NOT of that ilk either. In fact, they are all on the opposite side of the spectrum.

What Peter seems to be willing to do, and this isn't the first time to see posts of this nature from him, is to take the bait, hook, line, and sinker from a media source with an obvious bias and agenda, and accept as gospel, the context, or rather lack of, or even worse, false context, in an attempt to smear a fellow hunter of sound character.

He further seems unwilling, although he hasn't met most, or any of us, commenting here in person, even though one can very often get a pretty good feel for character through a history of posts, to accept that some of us actually do know all the parties involved in the video clip, be it the hunter, the outfitter, the PH, and the film crew. He seems unwilling to accept that we actually do know the circumstances behind the hunt depicted on the video clip and is unwilling to accept that we know the media source is whipping up hate toward the hunter with misinformation. He appears unwilling to accept it when we say the actual events of this hunt are misrepresented in the media story in a manner to achieve the most dramatic response from the masses who are uninformed as to the conservation benefits of hunting.

This has all been discussed before here. At what point do we take the offensive and attempt to put an end to the mob mentality of attempting to professionally destroy anyone who participates in an activity the left disagrees with, even when said activity is 100% legal and ethical. Ignore this crap at your own peril, right up to the point where the mob shows up at the end of YOUR driveway and it happens to you.

I don't know the answer as to how to fight the social media / social justice war we find ourselves in. It would seem to me that if cyberbullying is unlawful, that might be the foot in the door to begin effectively putting an end to this crap. At some point, the cyberbullies whipping up the mob in an effort to destroy a person's professional persona need to be hit in their own pocket book through libel or slander prosecution. In the mean time, we need to realize who is on our side and who is against us and stop letting those who are against us manipulate us into turning on our own without first ascertaining the actual facts. It's pretty easy for a photo of a dead ele cow from the valley (smaller in nature than other areas) to be passed off the the uninformed as a "baby" when a false story is pushed. It's pretty easy for a video of a sleeping lion to be passed off as canned or drugged when in fact, it had been tracked from the bait and was skillfully approached while sleeping off its meal.

Stop eating our own!!

I could not have said anything better than what Todd Williams stated above. Perfectly articulated

Mac,

Please re-read the post. Peter is the person claiming he has been asked to support machine gunning elephants.

Dead is dead. What consequence to the result whether the animal is aware of us or not? Asleep or not? Drugged or not? If we want to talk about 'sporting chance', we should be hunting with spears, maybe, not the deadly instruments that we have available now.

Killing is not pretty and it seems to be even less pretty on video broadcast on YouTube. Why do we hunt and kill? If we wrestle with explaining this to ourselves, there is NO WAY that we can expect to explain it to others. Let's stop with the 'kill shot' videos and give ourselves a chance.

I was told that this was a canned hunt, captive raised lion was shot up with an animal tranquilizer called Special K, which basically put him in a semi conscious state. He was then planted on a dried out river bed so the lion would be in plain site with nothing to hide in, the hunter then walks around the corner and bingo, pop goes the weasel. What other male lion would be by itself and then sleep in a wide open place with no concealment out in the sun...this is disgusting and should be banned but when the PH lays out 25K on a guarantee hunt what else would you expect.

Too much judging goes on these days, and too little deliberation.

The first tip to any reader should have been the paper that published that article.

It's a notorious and worthless rag.

quote:

Originally posted by raamw:
I was told that this was a canned hunt, captive raised lion was shot up with an animal tranquilizer called Special K, which basically put him in a semi conscious state. He was then planted on a dried out river bed so the lion would be in plain site with nothing to hide in, the hunter then walks around the corner and bingo, pop goes the weasel. What other male lion would be by itself and then sleep in a wide open place with no concealment out in the sun...this is disgusting and should be banned but when the PH lays out 25K on a guarantee hunt what else would you expect.

Quite simply, you were lied to.

quote:

All this simply shows the ignorance of the antis and those who take anything they post as gospel. If ignorance was painful, most anti hunting people would be screaming in pain 24 hrs a day!

……………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………………...

There is an old, old saying: Ignorance is bliss...

By Todd

quote:

Mac,

Please re-read the post. Peter is the person claiming he has been asked to support machine gunning elephants.

……………………………….. CORRECTED
My mistake! I must be the one to plead ignorance it seems!

I will go back and read Peter's post IF I CAN FIND IT that is!

…………………………………………….Hold your fire till I get my foxhole dug!
……………………………………………….

quote:

Originally posted by MacD37:
By Todd

quote:

Mac,

Please re-read the post. Peter is the person claiming he has been asked to support machine gunning elephants.

……………………………….. CORRECTED
My mistake! I must be the one to plead ignorance it seems!

I will go back and read Peter's post IF I CAN FIND IT that is!

…………………………………………….Hold your fire till I get my foxhole dug!
……………………………………………….

No problem Mac. Hell, I originally posted my response on the wrong thread. We all make mistakes.

quote:

Originally posted by Poyntman:
Make No Mistake...
We are in a FULL OUT CULTURE WAR folks...
Hunting...
Freedom of Speech..
Gun Rights...
Hell..Gender...
You name it...
The LEFT HATES US...they HATE everything and everyone that doesn't agree with their lunacy.
They hate your Religion...they Hate your culture...
It's time we all fight back on every issue..
Refuse to Apologize...
refuse to back down
Refuse to compromise...
You cannot be soft as this is their Game...Bully..Attack...Boycott...whatever...
You cannot placate the Mob...This is the Religion of the Left

Jeffive and Peter fall into the category of “The LEFT.” Fairly typical posts and conclusions from each of them exemplified here in this thread.

If The Daily Mail falls in the woods and no one reads it, does it make a sound?

All the extreme views about an attack on free speech, look around you there is so much free speech, we are drowning in it.

The "left" hates the "right", well there is an equal amount of evidence that the "right" hates the "left". The vast majority people in the middle are the ones who suffer by being bombarded by the halve truths, all out lies, and lack of context "free speech" from the both extremes.

What you must understand is that most people thankfully will never be know about about this non issue of shooting a sleeping lion. Of course the "right" is giving it legs currently. Thank goodness for freedom of speech.

If we would just enjoy the things we like to enjoy and not feel the urge to show off and post pictures and videos for the world to see, but some folks don't understand the power speech. And there giving it away for free.

So please remember as you are fighting your "culture war" the collateral damage is effecting the vast majority of people who don't give a fuck about it.

Some one on this very Thread wrote, "context is everything here." Well it's not just here, it's in everything.

Have a wonderful day, start by leaving your computer or smart device right now and go out and enjoy yourself.

Slim,
I lived the life you suggested...the majority of my life...until mid-40’s. I quit doing so when I woke up one day and noticed that all that stuff outside was changing and at a rapid pace. I realized then that complacency was as much of an enemy as the people perpetuating the change were.

Another fallacy of your antiquated approach is believing most people are in the middle. The left has gone so far extremely left that there is not much “middle” remaining. Today...there are only 2 types of people in the USA...left and right. And while I wish we would both live and let live...since about 2009...the left will NOT have that and plan to force the right to bend to their will. The right woke up a few years back.

And at the day you know you made a difference

Imagine how the Egyptians, Romans,.... felt. Curl up in a ball or live in reality. just saying

It is tooooo easy to think there is a left and a right. THINK HARDER

quote:

Originally posted by raamw:
I was told that this was a canned hunt, captive raised lion was shot up with an animal tranquilizer called Special K, which basically put him in a semi conscious state. He was then planted on a dried out river bed so the lion would be in plain site with nothing to hide in, the hunter then walks around the corner and bingo, pop goes the weasel. What other male lion would be by itself and then sleep in a wide open place with no concealment out in the sun...this is disgusting and should be banned but when the PH lays out 25K on a guarantee hunt what else would you expect.

And you believed that crap?

quote:

Originally posted by slim buttes:
If The Daily Mail falls in the woods and no one reads it, does it make a sound?

All the extreme views about an attack on free speech, look around you there is so much free speech, we are drowning in it.

The "left" hates the "right", well there is an equal amount of evidence that the "right" hates the "left". The vast majority people in the middle are the ones who suffer by being bombarded by the halve truths, all out lies, and lack of context "free speech" from the both extremes.

What you must understand is that most people thankfully will never be know about about this non issue of shooting a sleeping lion. Of course the "right" is giving it legs currently. Thank goodness for freedom of speech.

If we would just enjoy the things we like to enjoy and not feel the urge to show off and post pictures and videos for the world to see, but some folks don't understand the power speech. And there giving it away for free.

So please remember as you are fighting your "culture war" the collateral damage is effecting the vast majority of people who don't give a fuck about it.

Some one on this very Thread wrote, "context is everything here." Well it's not just here, it's in everything.

Have a wonderful day, start by leaving your computer or smart device right now and go out and enjoy yourself.

So what you're saying is don't count on you when one of our fellow hunters of good character is besmirched with false narratives of illegal or unethical conduct, just as long as it isn't you?

Good to know!!