Who should have final say on whether to shoot or not?

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18 December 2017, 08:10

SDhunter

Who should have final say on whether to shoot or not?

Saeed,
Your post above is why I do not hunt with a tape measure. I am not about to let inches of horn determine whether my hunt was a success or not.

There is so much more to the experience than the tape measurements.

18 December 2017, 10:14

fulvio

quote:
Originally posted by fairgame:

Shoot this one and don't ask questions

Too flat a curvature - I want one with tight curves, at least 45" and not splayed out at the tips.

18 December 2017, 14:01

fairgame

quote:
Originally posted by fulvio:
quote:
Originally posted by fairgame:

Shoot this one and don't ask questions

Too flat a curvature - I want one with tight curves, at least 45" and not splayed out at the tips.

Personally I like the brown ones with sticky up horns.

20 December 2017, 06:36

lavaca

Yes, it is the PH's responsibility to evaluate the animal to verify that he is legal and mature. I hunt with PH's I know and trust and they have veto power. I trust them to do that, both as to the animal, the shot, etc.

But, I have the ultimate veto power if I want something bigger or simply don't like the shot.

21 December 2017, 05:18

BuffHunter63

quote:
Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:
Buff,

Personally I don't think there should be any question about whether or not a hunter should shoot when the PH is recommending to hold fire. You hired the guy for his expertise so let him do his job. A client and the PH initially should get on the same page about expectations and what is a realistic and use that as a trophy guideline for the safari.

Mark

Occasionally the PH and you might have slightly different agendas. You want (usually) the biggest animal you see. The PH might want to save that animal for breeding, the client who is coming next week, who has booked many hunts with him before or is a fantastic tipper, shares his hot wife, etc.

I think this happens more than you might think.

JMO of course.

BH63

21 December 2017, 20:34

MacD37

quote:
Originally posted by SDhunter:
Saeed,
Your post above is why I do not hunt with a tape measure. I am not about to let inches of horn determine whether my hunt was a success or not.

There is so much more to the experience than the tape measurements.

Here here! Now the above was written by a HUNTER!

...................................................................

....Mac >>>===(x)===> MacD37, ...and DUGABOY1
DRSS Charter member
"If I die today, I've had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"~ME 1982

Hands of Old Elmer Keith

21 December 2017, 21:06

MARK H. YOUNG

Buffhunter63,

If you've suspected that the scenarios you laid out were the case in your previous safaris I think you've hunted with the wrong people. On an enclosure hunt the operator might have a breeder but usually they are in a smaller enclosure and you don't even see them. If the operator is saving an animal for some other client in my opinion he is unscrupulous and should be avoided. In my personal and business experience I've never run into this. I think it is very uncommon.

Mark

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22 December 2017, 07:45

Saeed

quote:
Originally posted by MARK H. YOUNG:
Buffhunter63,

If you've suspected that the scenarios you laid out were the case in your previous safaris I think you've hunted with the wrong people. On an enclosure hunt the operator might have a breeder but usually they are in a smaller enclosure and you don't even see them. If the operator is saving an animal for some other client in my opinion he is unscrupulous and should be avoided. In my personal and business experience I've never run into this. I think it is very uncommon.

Mark

Mark, this actually true.

I have known occasions where an outfitter would book a lion hunt knowing full well there are no shootable lions in that particular area.

They reserve them for their special clients, who get taken directly to where the lions are.

Sadly, this happening with some of the biggest outfitters operating in Tanzania.

22 December 2017, 16:42

BuffHunter63

I have been very fortunate in that I have had extremely honest PHs (one even took my side against the outfitter/owner in regards to an extra fee because of the size of tusks I wound up with on an Ellie hunt(we won because I always get in writing "any size horns/ivory, etc").

However I have been told stories by PHs of some less than honest dealings pulled by some outfitters or PHs. Sometimes things go sour so the PH tries to do some smoke and mirrors often at the clients expense.

BH63

22 December 2017, 21:45

MARK H. YOUNG

Guys,

Personally I think there are far more rumors of this saving the animal for a special client than actual instances of it happening. I've heard all of these stories too including overselling the quota and the poor PH having to ride the client around hoping to God they don't see a lion or whatever animal it is the operator oversold. I just have found it to be uncommon enough that I've never run across an actual instance of it.

Mark

22 December 2017, 22:30

fulvio

quote:
I just have found it to be uncommon enough that I've never run across an actual instance of it.

You as an agent would be the last to know about such games being played by the outfitter (unless you were to eat off the same plate).

22 December 2017, 23:30

Bud Meadows

quote:
Originally posted by ledvm:
I would never shoot anything that my PH didn’t give the go-ahead on...but once he does...I decide whether to or not. Many times I have passed.

The only time I was asked to NOT shoot a certain trophy was my first hunt in Namibia in 2012. The outfitter, Jan du Plessis of Sebra Safaris, was trying to re-introduce a herd of Springbok after leopards and hyenas had eaten up a lot of his Springbok herd. A beautiful dominant Springbok approached to within 200 yards of us, but I complied with Jan's request not to shoot him. Fast forward to May 2017 and on my fourth hunt with Jan, his Springbok herd now numbers at least 200, and he has at least 15-20 trophy males.