Buffalo Gores Man To Death

08 July 2001, 20:29

S.D. Man Gored to Death by Buffalo

CUSTER, S.D. (AP) - A man was gored to death by a buffalo in Custer State Park while photographing a free-roaming herd.

Ernest Barna, 76, of Allen Park, Mich., was with a group of visitors viewing the animals on Thursday when a large buffalo bull approached. All the visitors except Barna retreated to their cars, Park Superintendent Rollie Noem said.

The bull walked past, nudged Barna, then turned, gored him in the side and threw him, Noem said. Barna underwent surgery Thursday evening, but died Friday at Rapid City Regional Hospital.

In another incident at the park, a Texas man suffered a deep cut to his arm in a buffalo attack on Thursday and needed stitches. Jack Knight, 87, was treated at a hospital and released.

Noem said the two attacks happened in different areas of the park and were not connected.

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saeed@ emirates.net.ae

www.accuratereloading.com

09 July 2001, 00:12

p dog shooter

Well they are wild after all. Even money that he was a city folk.

09 July 2001, 00:45

<JohnDL>

Why do these things seem to happen AFTER these bozos have already reproduced? On the positive side, there will be two less democratic voters in the next election.

09 July 2001, 02:14

MacD37

It wont make any difference, they will recount till it comes out the way they want it anyway! But at least there are two less people to bad mouth hunters, and shooters!

These two were porbably amoung those who think Cape Buffalo are just "OLD MILK COWS" Huh, MikeinFLA?

You guys know the old saying "IF YOU MESS WITH THE BULL, YOU GET THE HORN!" Trouble is, most city folks have never heard that old saying!

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..Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY DESIGNS
Collector/trader of fine double rifles, and African wildlife art

09 July 2001, 04:24

Zero Drift

p dog - The sickening part is the Bison will be shot because of the moronï¿½s mistake. Most folks donï¿½t get the clue that these animals are wild and that we are intruding on their territory. When you are in their house, their rules apply - not Walt Disneyï¿½s.

You may recall seeing a video that was widely circulated on the Internet about to bozo that got out of his car at a game park to take a picture of a male lion sleeping. His wife remained in the car to shoot the video of her brave husband. What he failed to see was the female only a few feet away from him. What amazed me was the wife held the camera really still while her husband was being consumed. She should get an award or something.

I especially got tremendous pleasure hearing about Sharon Stoneï¿½s husband getting his toe sucked by a Komodo dragon for his birth day present. She was so appalled that this animal would attack someone - especially in Hollywood. I am sure she thought the animals would have acted more civilized; after all sheï¿½s a big star.

I only got one thing to say - Welcome to the outdoors yaï¿½ll.

09 July 2001, 04:47

<mikfla>

MacD37

Yea they look like a old milk cow to me but i do respect anything with horns and you can bet your bottom dollar if i was there taking pictures i would have retreated to the car with the other tourists in a rapid pace, just because there a milk cow does not mean they cannot be mean i have been chased by cows locally and i move out of the way.

I would not be caught with out a 45-70 or a 375 H&H if i was hunting them, and if one was wounded i would want something a bit bigger.

Yea they look like a Milk cow that does not mean they cannot kill me in short order tho, act accordily, the strong survive and the weak die, natures way of getting rid of the foolish.

09 July 2001, 06:35

JohnTheGreek

About a week before I visited Yellowstone Park about ten years ago, a woman was killed when she attempted to place her toddler on the back of one of those big shaggy critters for a photo opportunity. Apparently the toddler was uninjured.

09 July 2001, 07:13

Gatogordo

mikfla:

You would have had to be fast to have beaten me back to the car, Buffalo bulls are not real bright and tend to damage things that annoy them which is relatively easy to do.

I don't know if the bull will be shot or not, it might be hard to pick it out of the herd, they all have an attitude, and it was just being a typical Buffalo. The guy who got gored was obviously trying out for this years Darwin Awards. Not a great effort, but he deserves an honorable mention.

09 July 2001, 07:41

JackM

Terminal Bambiitis

Bye
Jack

[This message has been edited by JackM (edited 07-08-2001).]

09 July 2001, 09:14

p dog shooter

To zero dift they should of just let him rome free as the wind blows or was that born free. One of their lions ate one of their camp staff. The woman most likely had a very big insureance policy and wanted real good evidence on how he died.

09 July 2001, 09:19

<R. A. Berry>

This reminds me of my experience at Theodore Roosevelt Badlands National Park in the Dakota's.

One must be particularly wary of the solitary bull bison. My wife and I were driving around the park photographing the bison and mule deer. No problems until we came to a solitary bull grazing about 100 yards from the road.

We stopped and got out of the car to snap a picture of him. As soon as we stepped into the grass he started trotting toward us. So we had to jump back in the minivan and burn rubber to keep from being rammed by the bull. He came charging down the road after us too, coming to within yards of the back of the van as we peeled out.

That bull must have weighed about 3500 pounds. He dwarfed anything else in the park. His hump was taller than the minivan roof by a good margin. The solitary old bull, like the daga boys.

Surely Bison bison must be the heaviest bovids on the planet. Does anyone know of the actual weights of any large specimens?

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Good huntin' and shootin',
RAB

09 July 2001, 09:31

Atkinson

Aw guys thats just some old cows calf raised on milk for petes sake...

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Ray Atkinson

ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com

09 July 2001, 09:40

<X-Ring>

RAB
I don't know what they weigh, but while in Yellowstone park I once had one walk up to my truck and look me in the eye piont blank. O ya thats a 1975 F250 4X4! They are big!!! Growing up in the shadow of the park and spending my summers in the area of the park working summer jobs. You meet all kinds of Idiots from the city that think Yellowstone is some kind of a petting zoo. My friends Brad & Frank can spend days telling you about the people they stopped from putting their children on the backs of Elk, Bears & Bison. They worked in the park two summers.
I was there for a cull hunt with a friend whoes brother is a game warden here in MT. We didn't get to shot any, but got to watch as the wardens did. These are huge animals They used a BIG front end loader to put them in the trucks after gutting them.

X-Ring

[This message has been edited by X-Ring (edited 07-09-2001).]

09 July 2001, 09:41

<mikfla>

Ray,

LOL

[This message has been edited by mikfla (edited 07-09-2001).]

09 July 2001, 10:34

Yukoner

I don't know exactly how large the Plains bison get. I do know that some of the largest Wood bison taken in the Yukon have weighed around 2,300lbs. The Wood bison are,apparently, larger than the Plains Bison.
Even so, a large Plains bison weighing around 1,800 to 2,000lbs. is nothing a guy should mess with.Bison, though large and cumbersome looking, are quite agile. They can cover ground fast and can easily jump a fence that will hold domestic cattle.
There is a documentary film about the bison that were brought from the U.S. into Alberta,Canada. I wish I could remember what it was titled. It was very interesting. Anyway, they figured it would take only a few weeks to handle the bison brought in by rail. It took them months, mostly because of the difficulty in handling them. They broke through the sides of the rail cars, jumped or busted down corals, you name it. Lots of it on film. Some Bison were killed from shock and stress from being handled. They are very much wild animals.
They weigh more than an Yukon/Alaskan Moose.

Daryl

09 July 2001, 11:10

<R. A. Berry>

Daryl D,
An average mature plains bison bull weighs around 2000 pounds. Some of the really big ones are much larger than that. I always thought the woodland variety were smaller. Let's see if Andy, the bison rancher and ballistician can tell us what he thinks.

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Good huntin' and shootin',
RAB

09 July 2001, 11:46

Gatogordo

I dunno what one of them weighs but a friend of mines brother was going to use some fairly small buffalo calves for working his cutting horses. He bought 5 or 6 or them along with one female, had them shipped in and put them in a good tight wired cattle pen for the night. Took them about a week to catch them all. They were scattered around the countryside, would go through a regular fence like it was invisible. I don't think he ever did try to train his cutters with them.

I dunno if this is true or not since I am not a cutting horse afficionado, but I ran into one guy that swore(with a staight face) llamas were the absolute best for training them, would never sull up.

09 July 2001, 11:59

JohnTheGreek

Wood bison are, in fact, between 10 and 15% larger than the plains variety with a more pronounced, angular hump, and apparently long straight hair on their head that lays flat and forward.
I understand there is debate about how pure the existing "wood bison" are in Northern Alberta and the Northwest territories as there was a transplant of plains bison there in the 1920's.

JohnTheGreek

09 July 2001, 14:18

<500 AHR>

I am not sure how large the "wild" bison can get, but the old trophy bull I shot at a South Dakota ranch weighed in at just under 2400 pounds! The meat wasn't good for anything but burger though...too tough. The next time I feel the urge for buffalo meat I will shoot a meat bull instead (already have a trophy).

Todd E

09 July 2001, 19:30

Yukoner

Todd,
that is one big S.O.B.

John,
That is correct. There was 6000 Plains bison introduced to the Wood Bison National Park in the N.W.T. wich caused hybridization of the existing Wood bison herd. But then some bioligists looking for(whooping cranes?)in a remote area of the park spotted a small isolated herd. Apparently they landed their chopper and shot 2 or 3 to take samples. Sure enough, they were Wood bison that had not been affected by the Plains bison genetics. 42 of these bison were captured. these bison are the beginning of the current Wood bison recovery program. There are 4 herds now in Canada and one in Alaska. Here in the Yukon and B.C as well, could sustain alot more Bison than we currently have. In the Yukon we are trying to keep the number down to about 500 head. We are doing this so that the Wood bison don't spread out too much and come into contact with infected Bison(tuberculosis) or domestic cattle.
Another fine example and success story of hunters conservation efforts. It would not of happened with out us.

Daryl

10 July 2001, 09:24

jpb

Hi Daryl D

You as well-informed as many biologists about the history of the bison recovery.

I was mightily impressed by the bison when I worked in the NWT for the CWS a few years ago. I stopped to look at a bull (along the highway to Yellowknife) and he seemed to think that my truck was a rival trying to invade his territory. Charged me several times and I had to back up each time; finally he got bored and I was able to get by him and continue to Yellowknife. I heard a story of a bull doing likewise to a guy on a motorcycle -- sure glad I was in a truck!

I hope the brucellosis doesn't become a huge issue -- those ranchers are a powerful lobby group and the bison will be the losers.

John P. Ball

10 July 2001, 01:47

MacD37

quote:
Originally posted by JohnTheGreek:
About a week before I visited Yellowstone Park about ten years ago, a woman was killed when she attempted to place her toddler on the back of one of those big shaggy critters for a photo opportunity. Apparently the toddler was uninjured.

Let's just hope the toddler didn't inherit the woman's stupid gene!

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..Mac >>>===(x)===>
DUGABOY DESIGNS
Collector/trader of fine double rifles, and African wildlife art

10 July 2001, 06:54

Toomany Tools

Both should've been old enough to know better. For God's sake, they're both of the generation that survived the Great Depression and won WWII! What could they have been thinking?

10 July 2001, 11:26

Canuck

There are records of old bull plains buffalo going over 3000 pounds. Largest I ever read about went 3400 pounds. A recent issue of Smoke Signals (a Canadian Bison Association publication) has an ad in it, where a rancher claims to have a 3000+lb bull.

JohntheGreek: You are absolutely right about the difference in size between Woods and Plains bison. 10 to 15% bigger on average.

DarylD.: Wow, you know your bison! You got the stats on the Woods intro's bang on.

jpb: My Dad has a bison ranching operation. He's got about 110 head at the moment. In his second year of herd building, when he only had about $350,000 invested in 60 head, one of his cows tested positive for brucellosis. Thankfully the retest came out negative, or he would have had to slaughter the entire herd. Insurance would have covered less than 20% of his investment. Since there are no wild bison in the area there is zero threat of it spreading to wild stock (unlike the elk ranches in the area), but they take absolutely no risk with them anyway.

Regards,

Canuck

10 July 2001, 12:01

<333-OKH>

Fortunately the park administrators understand bison and have no plans to destroy either animal. Just bison being bison. Cows on steroids showing appropriate roid rage. [Helps thin out the tourists.] I'm amazed one of the bikers attending the Sturgis Rally & Races hasn't hit one yet. Bison vs Harley, wanna' take bets on the winner?

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If Elmer didn't say it, it probably ain't true.

10 July 2001, 12:38

<R. A. Berry>

O.K. guys. The wood bison is bigger on average than the plains bison. I can admit I was wrong. I would like to take this opportunity to show Ray Atkinson how it is done.

Some times we carry distorted concepts in our heads. As Ol'Sarge says, ignorance is curable, but stupidity is terminal, or something like that. This is a very educational site, where most often the distorted concepts get ironed out into the truth, plain and clear.

(Not so subliminal message: Ray, it is O.K. to admit a spacer is not a pillar bedding job.)

Anyway, I read somewhere about plains bison over 3000 pounds, and that 3400 pound figure Canuck mentioned sounds familiar.

I guess there are monsters in any species, when genetics and nutrition and possibly endocrine aberrations come together.

The rare monster bison may be a throwback to the prehistoric genes. The prehistoric bison were said to weigh 5000 pounds.

I have shot and butchered an 1800 pound water buffalo bull and a 1500 pound cow. The cow I did on my hands and knees with knife and axe and one assistant bwanawannabe. The bull I had the help of a front-end loader's hydraulics. See, I am capable of learning, and use of tools.

I have also seen plenty of bison up close that weighed a ton and under, on my wanderings through the plains states, and in the Yukon, or is that just Yukon, without the "the?"

I still swear the one that chased me in North Dakota weighed closer to two tons than one ton.

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Good huntin' and shootin',
RAB

[This message has been edited by R. A. Berry (edited 07-10-2001).]

10 July 2001, 13:42

<Andy>

RAB,

Big Boy, my Denver bull, would play with tractor tires if you rolled them to him. Hed hook them with his horn, roll it around like a hula hoop, and toss it up in the air. It was all my brother and I could do to tip it up on its rim and roll it at him.

then hed catch it with his other horn and toss it back to the other again!

He could also bang up the front quarter panel of an International pick up truck pretty good.

As Canuck and his dad can tell you, efficient slaughter weights drive when you butcher your bulls or steers.

For us in the 70's, it was between 1200 and 1600 pounds.

Bison are not mature until 7 years old!

they mature very slowly compared to domestic cattle.

We could not efficiently raise them over three years of age.

We had favorite cows than we kept for years (one for 25+ years), but the bulls and steers did most of their growing by three.

I have never eaten a big loan bull, but saw one in Colorado whose hanging weight dressed (without heart/lung or viscera)was 2,600 pounds.

I never raised them this big.

Andy

10 July 2001, 14:04

<R. A. Berry>

Andy,
Sounds like there are a few monster bison around somewhere. One of them lives in North Dakota. Bison bison is certainly in the running for biggest bovid on the planet.

I found your response to my question on the other thread. Thanks.

So, besides the high IQ bison (Einstein the Promethean teacher of fence leaping), there are other athetlic and entertainment interests amongst bison like Big Boy? Amazing! I did not know bison were so talented. Oh, well, that won't curb my appetite for bison burger.

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Good huntin' and shootin',
RAB

11 July 2001, 03:41

Canuck

RAB: I am presently reading a book my father lent me, called "Buffalo, Sacred and Sacrificed." There are some historical pictures in it of big old bulls from Banff National Park that would knock your socks off! They are HUGE!

My Dad has a breeding bull named Calamity that is 6 years old this year, that was 1950lbs when he traded for it last year. When it walks up to the truck, your jaw drops. The top of its hump is easily 6'4". But it ain't packing nearly the weight that the bulls in the pictures I referred to above are. There is very little utility in a 3000+lb bull for a rancher. If you are herd-building, you can't keep bulls for long as they should not (and generally will not) breed with their own progeny. And I wouldn't want the task of loading a 15 or 20yr old, 3000lb bull into a stock trailer! Most breeders look for bulls that have good conformation (heavy in front and back), that pack weight on fast. How big they will eventually get is of little concern. As an example, most ads say something like "Big Jim, 1450lbs at 2yrs" or "Dakota Bob, 2280lbs, he's big, he's black, he's gentle, and he throws the same".

Regards,

Canuck

11 July 2001, 12:29

<R. A. Berry>

Canuck,
No doubt the truly wild bison are wily and wary to the extreme. I saw a video of Pete Shepley (?) bowhunting them and he had a difficult time of getting to within bow range. He finally ambushed one by heading him off at the pass after scurrying and sneaking diligently, and many days glassing and stalking.

I will be on the lookout for that book. It would really be great if you could find a way to scan those big bull pics and post here for the members to guesstimate weights.

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Good huntin' and shootin',
RAB

12 July 2001, 02:56

Canuck

RAB,

The herds I hunted last winter were as wary as whitetails. I had the last 2weeks of December to hunt them, and there had been other people hunting them since the beginning of October. The sound of a snowmobile engine would send them into the thick bush from miles away. Stalking them on foot was futile due to the creaky snow, they could hear it 3 or 4 hundred yards off. Closest I could get was about 250 yards, which is the distance I eventually shot one at. Constant hunting pressure, and limitless escape terrain has made them truly wild again, and a heckuva load of fun to hunt.

I was trying to think of a way to scan those pic's for you, as I know you will be impressed. Unfortunately I do not have a scanner. I'll see what I can do, but it could take a few days. The author of the book is Grant McEwan if you are looking for it.

Regards,

Canuck