My Dad and I were going thru some of his guns today and he brought out a very nice double barrel 28 ga side by side double barrel shotgun.

The only markings I could find on it(other then proof marks)were : FLUSS STAHL on one of the barrels and KRUPP ESSEN on the other barrel. Both markings are near the end of the barrels at the reciever end. This gun is real light weight and from at least the 30's or 40's if not before. Beautiful workmanship. We know nothing about this shotgun as far as who made it(Krupp Essen is my guess)but who are they ?? , when it was made and a guess on the value. Any info as well as history & value or where I can get some info on this would really be appreciated.
TIA,
Charlie C

Charlie:

My German is pretty minimal and my knowledge of German shotguns is not a helluva lot better, but I can give you a couple of hints. Without consulting a german/english dictionary I think the writings mean "fluid steel" (as opposed to damascus or twist steel barrels) and Krupp Works. Krupp was the premier steel maker of Germany and "Krupp" steel was considered to be the best quality for barrels. As far as I know, Krupp did not manufacture shotguns, just the steel for the barrels, receivers, etc.

I suspect that your gun was made by one of them many German Gunsmith Guild members. It could also quite possibly be Austrian, the proof marks will likely tell you which. I also am guessing that the "Fluss Stahl" marking indicate that it is of an earlier era than you are thinking. I am guessing no later than the teens or 20s, but again, I am not up to speed on German guns.

The smaller ga helps it value (how long are the chambers?), being German hurts it a bit (over here) and not having a known maker is not helpful either. Is it engraved? Quality of wood? Buffalo horn buttplate and trigger guard?
I really would not want to guess at its value without more information and, of course, seeing the gun (or a good set of pics) would be very helpful?

[ 09-08-2003, 20:56: Message edited by: Gatogordo ]

Gatogordo,
Thanks for the info. I'll check the shotgun out a little more tomorrow and have a few more answers for you(chamber length etc...).
I do know it has a bunch of proof marks on it. Mostly on the reciever and a few on the underside of the barrels. Triggerguard is steel, as is buttplate. There is some engraveing, mostly on the pins that that are exposed and in a few other areas. Wood is really nice with lots of very fine line checkering and it also has a monte carlo type cheek rest.
I can send you pics if you'd like to check it out. I only have a scanner but I can take several pics of it and get the entire gun.
Do you have anyway to I.D. the proof marks or know where I can get this info ??
I appreciate the help,
Thanks ,
Charlie C

Try asking the folks over at:

http://gunshop.com/cgi-bin/ubbcgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=forum;f=1;hardset=;start_point=;DaysPrune=

Incredible amount of knowledge there.

CharlieC:

Sorry about the late reply, but to be honest, I don't have the references to go much past what I told you. Due to the lack of engraving, it sounds to me like you have a nice, but not high end shotgun, and, please remember that this is a Wild Assed Guess without seeing it in my hand, but I'd say, with a considerable lack of conviction, that it might be worth in the $1000 range and that is really only because of the gauge. If it was a 12 it might be half of that, depending on condition, of course.

Gatogordo & Ed,
Thank you both for the info you provided. I'll do some more checking around and see what I can find out about this rascal.
Thanks again,
Charlie C