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Cost of new doubles that are fully functional
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I was asked this today and did not know the answer so came here.

So what does a new double cost that will shoot both barrels together with both solid and soft and will not double on you. One barrel in a 470 going off a split second after the first would be very inconvenient.

Would the Searcy doubles do the job?
 
Posts: 7046 | Location: Sydney Australia | Registered: 14 September 2015Reply With Quote
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I think it is all relative. What level of accuracy is required of a DG double rifle? 50 or 75mm at 50 meters with either solids, softs, or combination of both would be sufficient for me. However, that often require reloading as the original regulations loads may no longer be known or available. When you get a combination of particular solid and soft load that print together then you can address whether the sights and the group location are in the same location.

The propensity to double can be either rifle or a shooter induced. Nothing can prevent doubling from the shooter strumming the trigger, however; the rifle should not jar off by rifle impact such as being dropped, firing recoil, or from the trigger finger hitting the front trigger when firing the rear trigger first. If you have followed my post you already know I value some sort of interrupter sear to insure there is no mechanically induced doubling. However, with proper sear engagement, sear angles, etc the probability of mechanically doubling should also be remote While a doubling can be a surprise, my first DG double was a new 470 which doubled on me twice. I knew something was different from normal both time but did not realize it was a double until I broke the action open and two cases were ejected. I was sure I had not strummed the triggers the second time and traded the rifle off. I have not had a double with any of my subsequent DG caliber double rifles.

I guess what I am saying, is there are a lot of choices/trade offs to be made. Do you want a classic double? If so be prepared to have a good double gun gunsmith clean, inspect, adjust as required and you will have a safe and reliable double that is not prone to doubling. You may also need to have the rifle regulated for a current loading or do significant load development with different bullets, powers, etc to get the combined soft/solid regulation you desire.

The same comments as above generally apply to a off-the-shelf modern double rifle. Unless used significantly or dirty inside the tear down inspection should not be required but would still be prudent. The load it was regulated for should be know but may no longer be available.

If you have a new double manufactured for you it should be custom fitted to you and you can specify what commercially available load is to be used for regulation. That will be one load of either a sold or soft bullet. Reloading may still be required to bring the second bullet type into the same grouping as the first bullet type. Some custom makers will also develop a load(s) as part of the manufacturing process and you can either contract to have that load duplicated or load your own.

At least in my experience, the selection, care, and feeding of a double rifle can be both exasperating and satisfying. However, the old Engineering adage that "Engineering is a study of compromises." applies. Once those compromises have been evaluated, the selection process can begin.
 
Posts: 128 | Location: Dallas area | Registered: 07 October 2012Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Mike McGuire:
I was asked this today and did not know the answer so came here.

So what does a new double cost that will shoot both barrels together with both solid and soft and will not double on you. One barrel in a 470 going off a split second after the first would be very inconvenient.

Would the Searcy doubles do the job?


About $10K and up.
 
Posts: 7832 | Registered: 09 January 2011Reply With Quote
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quote:
Would the Searcy doubles do the job?


Yes, the Searcy doubles will definitely do the job. I have two Searcys-one in 450-400 and the other in 375 Flanged. Both are extremely accurate and have taken game in Africa. 6 Buffalo with the 450-400. Eland, giraffe and impala with the 375 Flanged. I also have a Merkel in 470 NE and it's a nice double. I had it restocked with some custom wood a few years ago.
 
Posts: 15893 | Registered: 04 April 2005Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Todd Williams:
quote:
Originally posted by Mike McGuire:
I was asked this today and did not know the answer so came here.

So what does a new double cost that will shoot both barrels together with both solid and soft and will not double on you. One barrel in a 470 going off a split second after the first would be very inconvenient.

Would the Searcy doubles do the job?


About $10K and up.


I was that far out as I thought bout $15,000.
 
Posts: 7046 | Location: Sydney Australia | Registered: 14 September 2015Reply With Quote
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Searcy is among the best. My 450 will put any 480 grain bullet into 1.5 inches or less at 50 yards all day.
I have a Chapuis 9.3 that will stack bullets at 50, but that is a rarity.
The manufacturing standard is usually two inches at 50, yards, or meters.
I have never seen one double that was not the fault of the operator, but I have read about it happening.
 
Posts: 13313 | Location: USA | Registered: 02 August 2009Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Mike McGuire:
I was asked this today and did not know the answer so came here.

So what does a new double cost that will shoot both barrels together with both solid and soft and will not double on you. One barrel in a 470 going off a split second after the first would be very inconvenient.

Would the Searcy doubles do the job?


I just ordered a lefty Heym 88B for 20K+.
 
Posts: 892 | Location: Southern CA | Registered: 01 January 2014Reply With Quote
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Had a Merkel that would double most of the time. Happened 3 times in the first 10 shells if I remember correctly. And it was probably my 6th or 7th double I owned and never had a problem before or since. Had it repaired and don't remember the issue as this has been a decade or so now.


Mac

 
Posts: 1589 | Location: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: 01 February 2007Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by McKay:
Had a Merkel that would double most of the time. Happened 3 times in the first 10 shells if I remember correctly. And it was probably my 6th or 7th double I owned and never had a problem before or since. Had it repaired and don't remember the issue as this has been a decade or so now.



???????? I simply cannot understand why some people have a doubling problem with any Merkel double shotgun, or double rifle. Confused
I have two double Merkel rifles, a 470NE, and a 9.3X74 and have owned several Merkel double barreled shotguns over the years, and have never had one double with me shooting them. I must say that I have had several people double both Merkel double rifles, and all of them were new to double rifles, and most were firing that back trigger first, and got doubling. Confused
A couple of people who got doubling, I loaded the double myself and only loaded the right barrel, and handed the rifle to the novice without telling them the left barrel was empty. When they pulled the right trigger to fire the first shot, I took the rifle back, and checked the back trigger, and it had been strummed when the novice had fired the right barrel. That made sense, but some of the people had gotten doubleing when firing the back(trigger first) so I assumed the recoil especially on the 470NE double was because the front trigger was lighter pull than the back trigger. Then I was told by a trap shooter that people new to doubles often got doubleing when firing the back trigger first on the shotguns because they let the recoil make their trigger finger hit the front trigger enough to cause that trigger to rebound enough to fire the front trigger to fire.
This made sense once he told me about that because I simply could not under why they were getting doubling when firing the back trigger first. Then I remembered my youngest son getting a double discharge with a single trigger over/under 12 ga shotgun, and the Trap shooter told me that that often happens with a single trigger double because the single trigger recoils BACK, then moves FORWARD very quickly, causing the shooter to to touch the trigger again causing the other barrel to fire. All this happens in such a short time span that it seems like one very heavy recoiling seeming to be ONE VERY HEAVY RECOIL SHOT. My youngest son was only eight years old when that happened to him with a very light 12 ga single trigger shotgun.

................................... Confused oldMacD37


....Mac >>>===(x)===> MacD37, ...and DUGABOY1
DRSS Charter member
"If I die today, I've had a life well spent, for I've been to see the Elephant, and smelled the smoke of Africa!"~ME 1982

Hands of Old Elmer Keith

 
Posts: 14521 | Location: TEXAS | Registered: 08 June 2000Reply With Quote
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I had a Merkel 500NE that never doubled, but I did not like the “clubby” feel of the rifle.

Richard Harland told me a story back in 2007 about being invited to a manufacturers’ shoot in South Africa a few years prior and how one of the Merkels consistently doubled.


____________________________________________

"Build a man a fire, and he'll be warm for a day. Set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life." Terry Pratchett.
 
Posts: 3323 | Location: Wyoming | Registered: 25 February 2005Reply With Quote
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I also had a Merkel 500NE that I never doubled.

It did double twice however.

Once with a RSA PH that wanted to shoot it. I assumed since he was a PH, he would be familiar with double rifles. He put his index finger in the front trigger and middle finger on the rear trigger. Fired the right barrel and promptly doubled it.

The second was a friend who just wanted to shoot it. He strummed the rear trigger as it was the first time he'd shot a double. After the PH experience, I told him to only use his index finger. Didn't think about instructing him to use the crease between the first two finger joints and he touched it off using the tip of his finger, which of course slipped and touched off the rear as well.

Now days, anytime someone wants to shoot my doubles, unless I KNOW them, I only load one barrel until they've had a couple of shots with it.

That said, I know McKay is not unfamiliar with DR's so if he had one that doubled repeatedly, I believe he had one with an issue. Certainly not the first one we've heard of with that issue.

I also wouldn't hesitate to own another Merkel DR.
 
Posts: 7832 | Registered: 09 January 2011Reply With Quote
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I finally doubled my Merkel 500. Sloppy trigger technique. Good thing I was holding on tight! Good lesson to learn also it was not unmanageable like I had thought it would be so that was a good lesson. Light big bores with lightish triggers you need to be careful.....
 
Posts: 2484 | Registered: 31 December 2005Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by MacD37:
quote:
Originally posted by McKay:
Had a Merkel that would double most of the time. Happened 3 times in the first 10 shells if I remember correctly. And it was probably my 6th or 7th double I owned and never had a problem before or since. Had it repaired and don't remember the issue as this has been a decade or so now.



???????? I simply cannot understand why some people have a doubling problem with any Merkel double shotgun, or double rifle. Confused
I have two double Merkel rifles, a 470NE, and a 9.3X74 and have owned several Merkel double barreled shotguns over the years, and have never had one double with me shooting them. I must say that I have had several people double both Merkel double rifles, and all of them were new to double rifles, and most were firing that back trigger first, and got doubling. Confused
A couple of people who got doubling, I loaded the double myself and only loaded the right barrel, and handed the rifle to the novice without telling them the left barrel was empty. When they pulled the right trigger to fire the first shot, I took the rifle back, and checked the back trigger, and it had been strummed when the novice had fired the right barrel. That made sense, but some of the people had gotten doubleing when firing the back(trigger first) so I assumed the recoil especially on the 470NE double was because the front trigger was lighter pull than the back trigger. Then I was told by a trap shooter that people new to doubles often got doubleing when firing the back trigger first on the shotguns because they let the recoil make their trigger finger hit the front trigger enough to cause that trigger to rebound enough to fire the front trigger to fire.
This made sense once he told me about that because I simply could not under why they were getting doubling when firing the back trigger first. Then I remembered my youngest son getting a double discharge with a single trigger over/under 12 ga shotgun, and the Trap shooter told me that that often happens with a single trigger double because the single trigger recoils BACK, then moves FORWARD very quickly, causing the shooter to to touch the trigger again causing the other barrel to fire. All this happens in such a short time span that it seems like one very heavy recoiling seeming to be ONE VERY HEAVY RECOIL SHOT. My youngest son was only eight years old when that happened to him with a very light 12 ga single trigger shotgun.

................................... Confused oldMacD37


Don’t recall the issue other than it was mechanical problem. I always shoot front trigger first. Never had the issue with other guns. Have moved onto other guns. Only ended up with it as it was part of an estate package. Ran 40ish shells through it when I got it back and all was good. Weight is not well distributed with Merkels in my opinion. Clubbish like mentioned above. But decent value at their price point.


Mac

 
Posts: 1589 | Location: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: 01 February 2007Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by McKay:
quote:
Originally posted by MacD37:
quote:
Originally posted by McKay:
Had a Merkel that would double most of the time. Happened 3 times in the first 10 shells if I remember correctly. And it was probably my 6th or 7th double I owned and never had a problem before or since. Had it repaired and don't remember the issue as this has been a decade or so now.



???????? I simply cannot understand why some people have a doubling problem with any Merkel double shotgun, or double rifle. Confused
I have two double Merkel rifles, a 470NE, and a 9.3X74 and have owned several Merkel double barreled shotguns over the years, and have never had one double with me shooting them. I must say that I have had several people double both Merkel double rifles, and all of them were new to double rifles, and most were firing that back trigger first, and got doubling. Confused
A couple of people who got doubling, I loaded the double myself and only loaded the right barrel, and handed the rifle to the novice without telling them the left barrel was empty. When they pulled the right trigger to fire the first shot, I took the rifle back, and checked the back trigger, and it had been strummed when the novice had fired the right barrel. That made sense, but some of the people had gotten doubleing when firing the back(trigger first) so I assumed the recoil especially on the 470NE double was because the front trigger was lighter pull than the back trigger. Then I was told by a trap shooter that people new to doubles often got doubleing when firing the back trigger first on the shotguns because they let the recoil make their trigger finger hit the front trigger enough to cause that trigger to rebound enough to fire the front trigger to fire.
This made sense once he told me about that because I simply could not under why they were getting doubling when firing the back trigger first. Then I remembered my youngest son getting a double discharge with a single trigger over/under 12 ga shotgun, and the Trap shooter told me that that often happens with a single trigger double because the single trigger recoils BACK, then moves FORWARD very quickly, causing the shooter to to touch the trigger again causing the other barrel to fire. All this happens in such a short time span that it seems like one very heavy recoiling seeming to be ONE VERY HEAVY RECOIL SHOT. My youngest son was only eight years old when that happened to him with a very light 12 ga single trigger shotgun.

................................... Confused oldMacD37


Don’t recall the issue other than it was mechanical problem. I always shoot front trigger first. Never had the issue with other guns. Have moved onto other guns. Only ended up with it as it was part of an estate package. Ran 40ish shells through it when I got it back and all was good. Weight is not well distributed with Merkels in my opinion. Clubbish like mentioned above. But decent value at their price point.


An M37 is far more fun and far more reliable. Big Grin


Formerly "Nganga"
 
Posts: 2428 | Location: Phoenix, Arizona | Registered: 26 April 2010Reply With Quote
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Doubtful! It floats, so we all know how that goes. Big Grin


Mac

 
Posts: 1589 | Location: Salt Lake City, UT | Registered: 01 February 2007Reply With Quote
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