I was advised years ago to break in a barrel using the shoot one, clean, shoot two, clean routine for the first 20 or so rounds. I was advised to first run a patch down the bore wetted with Sweet's 7.62, then a patch wetted with Kroil, then a couple of dry patches between shots. This was for Savage barrels.
Anyone have any thoughts on this practice, and the products I mentioned?
I have a new Savage in the house, and ran a few patches with JB bore paste down the bore to get the process started. Hope to actually break in the barrel this weekend.

Where to start, well, leave the Sweets at home. To make it work right, you have to scrub it to a froth. about 20 strokes will do it, then let it sit a few minutes before patching out. Break-in is tedious enough without going through that process. Kroil is ok, but you really need to use a regular bore solvent. I use a 50/50 mix of Kroil and Butch's Bore Shine.

I don't completely dry patch the bore out either. I will only run 1 dry patch through before shooting again. I want it to have just a little residue left in there for the first shot, and that's not only during break-in, that's every time I clean the barrel.

With a Savage barrel, it's only worth cleaning between shots for the first 5 if you really feel like you need to do it at all.

I always follow the barrel manufacturer's recommendations. I know many will say it is a waste of time but I figure "why not".
Phil

Technically you're trying to break in the throat where the chambering disturbed the barrel more than the barrel itself.

For a factory barrel, I shoot and clean 3-5 shots depending on how much "blue" I'm getting and then limit it to 3 shot groups for a couple groups.

For custom barrels, I follow their instructions and its about 2x more than I do for a factory barrel.

This should allow the barrel to be smoothed out with gassed and friction without too much copper buildup.

I use BoreTech stuff and have been pleased.

We all adhere to our own cleaning religion.



Zeke

My routine for new high quality barrels.
Shoot.
Clean if you want to.
Shoot more.
For lower quality barrels, you might have to scrub out copper; in which case, trash it and get a good one.
PM me for the name of the ones I use.

Quality of bbl. is paramount, I agree. Once upon a time, Douglas was king of the mountain but glory days pass. I have been known to break in a new bbl. using low velocity cast bullet loads w/ oil + fine grit valve lapping compound. It will even everything out.

Just for the heck of it, I looked up the topic in the Savage FAQ section and they simply reprinted the old routine recommended years back in Precision Shooting Magazine, which ceased publication in 2012. I enjoyed that magazine and was sorry to see it fold.


Although there may be different schools of thought on barrel break-in, this is what Precision Shooting Magazine recommends:

STEP 1 (repeated 10 times)

Fire one round
Push wet patches soaked with a powder solvent through the bore
Push a brush through the bore (5 times in each direction)
Push dry patches through the bore (2 times)
Push wet patches soaked with a copper solvent through the bore
Push a brush through the bore (5 times in each direction)
Push dry patches through the bore (2 times)
Push a patch with 2 drops of oil through the bore
STEP 2 (repeated 5 times)

Fire a 3 shot group
Repeat the cleaning procedure from STEP 1 after each group
STEP 3 (repeat 5 times)

Fire a 5 shot group
Repeat the cleaning procedure from STEP 1
They recommend the use of a patch with 2 drops of oil after the cleaning so that you are not shooting with a dry bore. It is also advisable to use a powder solvent and copper solvent from the same manufacturer to be sure they are chemically compatible.

I've done the barrel break-in thing with some new barrels/rifles but not with others. After 100 rounds or so it all seemed pointless. It would be interesting to see two identical barrels, one broken-in and the other not, scoped before shooting, after 20 shots, after 100 shots, and after 300 shots to see if it really matters or if it's just hype.

I solved this issue by purchasing used rifles.

It worked.
They all shoot fine.

posted 26 February 2022 10:30 Hide Post
"Quality of bbl. is paramount, I agree. Once upon a time, Douglas was king of the mountain but glory days pass. I have been known to break in a new bbl. using low velocity cast bullet loads w/ oil + fine grit valve lapping compound. It will even everything out."

Once the world-renowned master shooter has spoken, there is no longer any need for discussion.

Well you openned up a can of witches brew, a multitude of methods.

All my guns shoot under an inch, over the years thats the ones Ive kept. most will shoot most loads to same POI to different degrees..Had to buy or trade a lot of guns buying and selling to put that group together..I didn't break them in, I just shot them, talk to a 100 benchresters and you will get 50% Pro and con..I even know one gun smith and famous benchrester who claimed to shoot 300 rounds as fast as he could??? HIs guns shot great, I suppose its a process of polishing, but I know I have shot a number of Lothar Walther right out of the box that would eat up a 1/2 inch bullseye and everyone Ive used came out of the box shooting an inch or better..

I also know of some benchresters that buy Hart barrels in groups of 20 then start testing without breakins, they only keep the ones that match their standard, then toss or sell the rest Im told..

I asked a serious benchrest shooter about this at the shooting range a couple of days ago, and he basically said what Tom said: "Buy a high quality barrel in the first place and just shoot it."
On my beer and Spam budget, I will have to do the best I can with the button-rifled Savage factory barrel.

I remember reading about accuracy tests with 1903s. They found the accuracy quickly increased as the round count went up. Then at some point, around 2000 rounds as I recall, accuracy slowly decreased until accuracy was unacceptable thousands of rounds later. So, wouldn't breaking-in or lapping a bore just get you to the same higher level of accuracy quicker? And if so, would it also mean that you would reach unacceptable accuracy sooner? Just thinking out loud.

well you know, ed, that if you spent half as much time listening,applying, + experimenting as you spend on caustic remarks; you might someday learn something; but I doubt it.

Maybe some time you can teach me all you know about this, and nearly, every other subject.
Life is way too short to miss out out your rich treasure of info.

quote:

Originally posted by Grenadier:
I remember reading about accuracy tests with 1903s. They found the accuracy quickly increased as the round count went up. Then at some point, around 2000 rounds as I recall, accuracy slowly decreased until accuracy was unacceptable thousands of rounds later. So, wouldn't breaking-in or lapping a bore just get you to the same higher level of accuracy quicker? And if so, would it also mean that you would reach unacceptable accuracy sooner? Just thinking out loud.

To a point, I think you're correct but I have also read very little "break in" procedures that recommend lapping the bore.

A quality barrel should not require lapping but rather just a smoothing out of the throat where it's been disrupted by chambering. The gasses and bullet will do this job in a few rounds and the reason behind cleaning between shots is to keep the copper to a minimum.

The first round will always produce the most coppering and should diminish over subsequent rounds. Good barrels and clean chamberings should be about all cleaned up in about 10 rounds depending on the the individual rifle.

To shoot and properly clean after each shot for 3-5 shots and then clean after 3 shots a couple times should do the trick and not produce excessive wear. I always take this time to get the rifle on paper and then fine tune and load development later.

Once done, it's easy to get 20+ rounds down the tube with little or no coppering.

Zeke

Ed, theres not enough hours in the day, but that does not mean that a person should go through life not learning everything that they can. It helps in a well rounded education. Besides, I have raised my sons to have a good work ethic + after military service they have always been employed; actually 2 of them now own their own businesses + they KNOW how to do most everything. + that is a parents best gift to their children. I hope you can say the same about your kids.

Zeke, I think your middle way is sound, and will use it on this inexpensive Savage barrel.

quote:

Originally posted by Bill/Oregon:
Zeke, I think your middle way is sound, and will use it on this inexpensive Savage barrel.

You can't go wrong with that, Bill.
Best of luck to you sir.

Zeke

You can't compare an 03 barrel to a good barrel made today, crude by current standards.

Breaking in a barrel = the same as wearing out the barrel...

Such only applies to bench rest shooters, a hunter is disinterested and satisfied with his personal perception of required accuracy..Mine would be an inch at 100 in most cases..Some of todays smiths and gunbuilders claim a rare true 1" gun is of miracle status, HORSEFEATHERS to that!!

After all the voodoo recipes for “proper break in” and most of the good competition shooters saying they don’t break them in, my compromise is to call my load development for the new gun the equivalent of break in.

I wouldn’t take a rifle hunting or to a match without figuring out what load it likes, so most of my match or hunting rifles have between 50-500 rounds through them before the first serious use.

I do tend to clean after each “use” a hunting trip, weekends shooting, or such so it’s like every 20-50 rounds during work up.

The higher end gunmakers generally don’t tell me to do any breakin procedure, so that’s my default.

When I did do it, I didn’t see any appreciable improvement that I attributed to break in. Good guns shot well, bad ones didn’t, and mediocre stayed mediocre.

The rifles I've taken the time to do the shoot clean break-in all seem to shoot the first cold bore shot in the same group as the following shots whether the bore was clean or fouled.Does break-in work?Hard to prove,but the first cold bore shot is something I have observed on the rifles I did break-in.

quote:

Originally posted by Tailgunner:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TRRahHX9Zkg

Brought to you by one of the biggest dickheads on the interweb.

I always have a bore snake handy and the more Ive used them, the better I like them, a dab of cleaner on the wire brush part and pull through is said to be 180 pass thru patches, and Im convienced...best thing since sliced white bread!!

When you say cleaner Ray, what are you using?

My concern with Bore Snakes is unless they are thoroughly cleaned you are dragging yesterdays dirt through the bore of todays gun

Wow I've been building or have had built rifles since 1975. I've always used quality barrels. My procedure is very detailed. Clean the barrel and go shooting. Even bench rest barrels.

If someone has actually shot and cleaned for the first 5, they can actually see how much copper needs to be removed from the barrel in the first 3 shots. If not, they don't have a clue.

At the very least, I shoot and clean the first 3 and decide from there what I want to do.

Once the throat area is smoothed out during break-in, there's not a TON we can really do about the barrel.

No doubt we will all do what we think best or whether it's worth it or not ...or if we want to take the time. All depends on what a guy is looking for.

Isn't choice a wonderful thing?

Zeke

quote:

Originally posted by ZekeShikar:
If someone has actually shot and cleaned for the first 5, they can actually see how much copper needs to be removed from the barrel in the first 3 shots. If not, they don't have a clue.

At the very least, I shoot and clean the first 3 and decide from there what I want to do.

Once the throat area is smoothed out during break-in, there's not a TON we can really do about the barrel.

No doubt we will all do what we think best or whether it's worth it or not ...or if we want to take the time. All depends on what a guy is looking for.

Isn't choice a wonderful thing?

Zeke

Yep.

It seems to me that if you clean after every shot, every other shot, or every three or five or ten shots, it doesn't matter.

You need to get down to bare steel once in a while, and the number of shots between doing that seems immaterial to me.

Of course, I'm not measuring my groups down to the hundredth of an inch, either.

quote:

Originally posted by Michael Robinson:
It seems to me that if you clean after every shot, every other shot, or every three or five or ten shots, it doesn't matter.

You need to get down to bare steel once in a while, and the number of shots between doing that seems immaterial to me. Of course, I'm not measuring my groups down to the hundredth of an inch, either.

That's true Michael but the reason to clean between each shot for the first 3-10 shots is to make the chore easier and much faster, not shoot for groups. If the rifle is allowed to build up several carbon and copper layers, it becomes really time consuming.

This buildup really settles down for me after 3 shots and is about as good as it will get in 10. Oh, that first shot in a freshly chambered barrel is most certainly the worst copper fouling shot so I would "recommend" at least thorough cleaning and de-coppering for 1 shot.

I take the first few shots (and clean thoroughly between shots) to get it on paper and so it has very little to do with shooting for a group.

If someone is breaking in a brand new barrel, it's usually new to them and the scope needs to be zeroed to hit paper anyway.

The beauty of all this is that we can all do what we THINK is best for us. Ain't freedom a great thing?

(I just went through all this on Saturday with a Proof barrel chambered in a new long-throat 33 Nosler. It wonderfully settled down after the shoot-and-clean for the first 3 rounds)

Zeke

That makes sense.

Found this on the Shilen rifle barrels website and had to laugh:

"How should I break-in my new Shilen barrel?
Break-in procedures are as diverse as cleaning techniques. Shilen, Inc. introduced a break-in procedure mostly because customers seemed to think that we should have one."

Of course, they also point out that they hand lap their barrels.

I'm no expert by any means. My experience has been when I was using McGowan barrels I followed their recommendation. I would get quite a bit of copper out after 40 or so rounds. Then we had a falling out which is a story for another day. I switched to Douglas barrels and the last few barrels showed zero difference in the first few shots to the last few shots in accuracy and were significantly cleaner at the end of day cleaning. So barrel quality makes a difference.

I use two rifle builders in Phoenix; one makes his own barrels and the two I have from him are my most accurate. He says "just shoot it" - breaking in a barrel is a waste of time.

He is a very competitive F Class shooter.

Joh,
I use any oil or cleaner to mostly lub the brass brush of the bore snake...

As to a bore brush picking up junk, keep them in a plastice box, and wash then in a sock from time to time.

As to gunk, just a bore sitting in your shop can gather dust and what all, whatever it is in the bore I recon should be "softer than steel" such as lead, copper fouling.

Bottom line is Ive never seen all this as a problem, and Ive never ruined a bore, and as far as I know all my keepers shoot well enough to hunt with, and Im good with that and happy to let others more critical than I worry about squeeky clean bores.

What is the worst case scenario for NOT breaking in a barrel? Some copper fouling? I have a real effective trick for removing copper fouling.
I go to the range, come home and clean. That is my "break in" procedure.

shoot clean shoot again broke in