I am considering a trip there in September. I have a few questions that I am hopeful someone can help me with.

1- Can a high Altai Argali be imported into the US?

2- Has anyone ever heard of an outfitter named Eldos Altai?

3- Any comments on traveling, gun issues, etc would be appreciated.

Thanks!

http://www.fws.gov/forms/3-200-21.pdf


Larry,

Link to import permit application for the High Altai Argali. When the hunt was $65,000 my husband was on the waiting list for two years and then USFWS was only issuing a small number of import permits it looked like he was never going to go so he got his $15,000 deposit refunded and spent the money on a Desert Bighorn.

Now that it is a six figure sheep hunt there seems to be no waiting anymore.

He got a call a few weeks ago from a hunter for a reference on a booking agent as this gentlemen was planning on shooting a High Altai and a Hanghai on the same trip.

Best of luck, definitely the "King of Sheep".

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
I am considering a trip there in September. I have a few questions that I am hopeful someone can help me with.

1- Can a high Altai Argali be imported into the US?

2- Has anyone ever heard of an outfitter named Eldos Altai?

3- Any comments on traveling, gun issues, etc would be appreciated.

Thanks!

Probably the worst country in the world. Terrible xenophobic population and a terrible political system. Food is crap too.

Its not Zim. If there is a real screw up - Accidental discharge shooting, traffic accident anything goes wrong. Be prepared to spend time in a Mongolian jail or be denied ability to leave country.

It is a truly corrupt country with none of the benefits of corruption - Zim for example. It is the polar opposite of Zim - stuff gets done in Zim. In Mongolia you become a political tool.



http://qz.com/52094/mongolia-d...-that-business-trip/

http://time.com/3696794/mongol...on-mining-southgobi/

Its a joke of a country and there are real risk that few booking agents will tell you about and no one will show up if in some screwed up situation one ends up in the Mongolian legal system. Eventually the US government will get you out but it would really suck. Its not a packaged vacation like Africa.

I would stay away and I know a few people held up in Mongolia's corrupt legal and political system.

Mike

I know quite a few Foreign Service folks that have done time there.

It may be pretty, it may be an interesting culture, but the place is pretty rough.

It is considered to be on of the worst non-combatant country tours in Asia in the Foreign Service.

2 years of red tape and BS.

Only reason to go to Mongolia is in 10-25 years you can say you went to a country that no longer exists.

China will invade and take over Mongolia.

2 mil. Mongolian in Mongolia.

5 mil. Mongolians in China.

Mongolia has all the resources that China needs.

China has a territorial disputes with all its neighbors including nuclear powers. But none with Mongolia that it is making public.

No one has invaded Mongolia other than China and Russian - even UK that fought with nearly every country could not make it to Mongolia.

One day Mongolia will become another Chinese province and no one will say or do anything.

And yes I have shorted Mongolian sovereign bonds in the past.

Worthless country that does not need to exist.

On hunting - there is real risk in this country. Everything is screwed up for a government and legal point of view. Nothing is consistent.

If you use global rescue and say its for worst case insurance. Then what about the risk of accidents or any basic negligence or anything going wrong. You as an outsider will be on the hook for all things that go pear shaped. Also as a US citizen I would go when there is Khaan Quest which is US Mongolian military exercise.

Mike

I was there for 3 weeks with my brother back in 1986. It was awesome and completely different than some describe the conditions of today. How quickly things change in the world of hunting!

We both killed Gobi rams, ibex, gazelle and stag. What an wonderful adventure! It was truly one of "those" trips. My intel is of no value since it's 30 years old! Round trip I spent about 10K which meant my "slam" Stone sheep was pushed way back and I didn't make it on that hunt until 2003.

Thanks for letting me ramble and reminisce.

Zeke

You need to add a few days to hunt wolf with eagles if you go on that trip, and buy me a airline ticket and I will photo that trip for free

quote:

Originally posted by A.Dahlgren:
You need to add a few days to hunt wolf with eagles if you go on that trip, and buy me a airline ticket and I will photo that trip for free

If I was hunting or visiting Mongolia I would definitively take Anton along. Not so much for his excellent photographs (which I have framed all over my house) but as insurance if things go pear shaped - Anton is the guy to blame and let the Swedish government get him out

Mike

quote:

Originally posted by Beretta682E:

quote:

Originally posted by A.Dahlgren:
You need to add a few days to hunt wolf with eagles if you go on that trip, and buy me a airline ticket and I will photo that trip for free

If I was hunting or visiting Mongolia I would definitively take Anton along. Not so much for his excellent photographs (which I have framed all over my house) but as insurance if things go pear shaped - Anton is the guy to blame and let the Swedish government get him out

Mike

Well, I am being offered a hunt at a really good price for high Altai Argali. I THINK the person offering it is reputable. However, the Mongolian company is new. In other words, I cannot get any references.

I do find things about the head man. Apparently, his family is connected. His father was a government minister. I see some things related to hiking but not hunting.

Decisions, decisions, decisions...........

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
Well, I am being offered a hunt at a really good price for high Altai Argali. I THINK the person offering it is reputable. However, the Mongolian company is new. In other words, I cannot get any references.

I do find things about the head man. Apparently, his family is connected. His father was a government minister. I see some things related to hiking but not hunting.

Decisions, decisions, decisions...........

Larry the problem is Mongolia is not Africa. Political connections are irrelevant cause political power is not held by certain party or tribe or group. It's fluid - changes and it's very populist.

Mongolia makes Zim/Unlce Bob look like a rational long term actor.

Now most likely nothing happens and you come back with an adventure and a great hunt report on AR. But the reality is the country risk in Mongolia is real and hunting industry is irrelevant. No one will have the political pull to get hunters out of a jam - not the same situation in Zim or Pakistan.

Mike

Larry,

If you are considering going, you might want to check with USFWS to ascertain if the Altai Argali import permits for the 2016 season have already been issued.



Note 2. This form should be used only if you intend to hunt in Mongolia, the Kyrgyz Republic (Kyrgyzstan),
and the Republic of Tajikistan (Tajikistan) that has annual quotas on the take of argali. Any permits
issued will be conditioned that the permit is valid only if, at the port of entry, evidence from the
conservation agency in the country of origin is presented showing that the trophy was part of that quota
(e.g., copy of hunting license). If you are hunting in a different country, please use form 3-200-20
http://www.fws.gov/internation...rm-number/index.html.
Note 3. Typically the Service receives more applications for permits than we are able to issue. In order to
create the most equitable distribution system for issued permits, we have developed a specific
procedure for accepting and ranking argali applications. Please see a discussion of this procedure on
our website (http://www.fws.gov/international/permits/by-form-number/index.html).

I decided to pass. Too many questions for my piece of mind.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
I decided to pass. Too many questions for my piece of mind.

Smart move - Unless you are Rio Tinto and deal with the Mongolians thru political connections and super major mining status. Mongolia country is best left to idiots running that country.

Mike

PM sent to Larry

I hunted in Mongolia twice, 1992 and 1995 and had great hunts both times.

I did not find it to be any different than any of the other ex Soviet block countries that I have hunted in. Have things changed that much in Mongolia, to now make it unsafe for foreign hunters?

Can anyone else who has had more recent experience chime in.

Aziz

I could not get comfortable with the high Altai argali. Too many uncertainties. There was a gobi argali that I was very comfortable with. Timing was not good for me. I am still thinking about it.

Would be hard to pass a good deal on that quarry, the king of sheeps... alongside the kashmir markhor the two top mountain game trophies

I hunted there last year and absolutely loved the hunt, people, and game quality. The Mongol people are extremely accommodating and really want to please. Shot a nice Altai Ibex and saw over 30 males the first two days. I was a little skeptical at first because I was traveling by myself, but loved it. I would go back again in a second. The only negative is the travel time, but that is part of the adventure.

I hunted 8 times in Mongolia between 1990 and 1999. It was then a wonderful wild country. Last year I returned to hunt Ibex in the Altai and had an excellent hunt with a reliable, honest, excellent local operator. But I could not recognize the country nor most of its inhabitants. Fundamentally I agree with Beretta, although anyone can still enjoy a nice hunt and some outstanding trophies there : It all depends of the operator selected. Beware : there are lots of overnight and/or corrupted outfitters. This year I was heading for an High Altai argali and got a licence in best area...until a minister grabbed it to offer it to a foreign guest : I cannot sue the mongolian government...

I leave next week for few weeks of Taimen fishing. I was last there for fishing and great bird shooting in 2008. I hear things have really changed since then. Will provide feed back upon return.

I was there in 99 and loved it. Even the food was wonderful; I remember trout that I liked so much I asked them to cook it a second time.

I wasn't impressed with their idea of hunting gazelle: basically running them down in a jeep. I said forget it.

I heard from a hunting friend last night. He does a lot of world wide hunting. He has been all jacked up because he was going to Mongolia for a Hangai Argali. He was going somewhere where he was supposed to get a truly enormous sheep. He didn't go because he could not get a permit from USFWS. He had $150,000 up if I recall correctly.

The government in Mongolia has once again changed in the elections of this past July. We anticipate a reduction in licenses for argali sheep and possibly also for ibex for the 2017 season.


This was from a booking agent's newsletter I just received.

I saw that.

I can tell you that I have been offered both high Altai & Gobi Argali hunts at incredible discounts for this year. For example, I was just offered a high Altai for less than $50,000.

I never thought I would see those prices. I may end up going if a real estate purchase I am working on falls through.

Next year might be interesting.

That is one hell of a deal, you should seriously consider it Mr. Shores, as I said it is the top of the top in sheep hunting and only compares with a markhor for the top mountain game.

If this real estate purchase falls through, I am going.

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
If this real estate purchase falls through, I am going.

I LOVE your attitude Larry. You definitely do live life to the fullest...good for you my friend

quote:

Originally posted by larryshores:
I saw that.

I can tell you that I have been offered both high Altai & Gobi Argali hunts at incredible discounts for this year. For example, I was just offered a high Altai for less than $50,000.

I never thought I would see those prices. I may end up going if a real estate purchase I am working on falls through.

Next year might be interesting.

Buy the real estate.

I would trip the trophy back with me on the flight out from Mongolia. Don't trust any government in Mongolia.

Mike

Larry,

Just saw your post regarding the price. If you can get a High Altai for under $50,000 please contact me and my husband will go with you at that price.

All the prices I have seen are in the low hundreds and some hunters have paid far in excess of two hundred thousand.

My husband never thought he would get another chance at High Altai since the prices went through the roof.


Apparently no one has been able to bring their trophies back as USFWS is awaiting more information from the Mongolian Government.

Thank you.

Larry,

Sent you a PM with our home number.

Thanks

Not to be Debbie Downer...and I wish you all the luck in the world...but, at LEAST outside of the developed world, there is often nothing more expensive than a cheap hunt.

JMHO

I am not going.

Is the hunt still available or did you learn more about it that changed your mind. I'd go in a heartbeat for $50k.

I am coming back from Zim a day or two before i would have to leave. I am working on buying a ranch . I had reason to think it was going to crater. It seems to be moving forward now. I need to stay to work on the purchase . In addition , there was a question on whether i could get an import permit. It is still available as far as I know.

pm me details if you don't mind.