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.308s to .311s
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Hallo Folks.

As an upcomming .303 shooter I would like to shoot 215grainers without paying too much for the heavy woodleighs. I think I saw something some years ago about "bumbing-up" a bullets caliber by knocking/pressing the bullet in a die of some form.
I wonder then if I could "push-up" some hornadys 220grainers i .308cal to .311??
Anybody knows?

Thanks J


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Posts: 2805 | Location: Denmark | Registered: 09 June 2005Reply With Quote
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http://www.ch4d.com/
Has made specialty dies for me in the past , not exactly the specific " bumping die set" you need, but they might.


Take a look at this from :

http://www.bulletswage.com/pf.htm

"Sometimes, a person wishes to "bump up" a smaller commercial bullet to larger diameter, such as making a .311 bullet out of a .308, or a .228 bullet out of a .224. While this is possible, the results usually are not quite the same as making a bullet by properly swaging it in a 3-die set. Putting the undersized bullet into the larger point forming die is the same as using an undersized core seater die: you get the same kind of taper, bulging, and other problems that would not occur if the bullet were swaged from a core and jacket. The pre-existing ogive and nose shape have an effect on the operation, as well, so sometimes it works reasonably well, and sometimes it doesn't. We can provide the point forming die to use as a "bump up" die for jacketed bullets, but we cannot guarantee the results. This is a "try and see at your own expense" proposition, because whatever bullet you choose to bump up will have an effect on how well it works...even the same diameter and weight and shape of bullet from a different manufacturer or different production run can have enough difference in its jacket hardness, thickness, core material, and other springback factors so that the diameter and taper are different, using the same "bump up" die.

The good news is, that the same point form die you order for "bumping up" a bullet will be the same one you need later if you decide to do it right and make your own bullet. So, it isn't a waste of money. You can just add the core swage and core seater, and swage excellent bullets of the proper weight and diameter."


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Posts: 4593 | Location: TX | Registered: 03 March 2009Reply With Quote
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This is the other option. None cheap. Cost about the same to set up to make your own bullets and probably a much higher quality bullet, but for "just a few..." Awful expense. Luck...

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Posts: 519 | Registered: 29 August 2007Reply With Quote
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Oh yes, you understand that a ton of .30/7.62 European rounds don't use actual .308 bullets... rather... .311, .312, .313, .314, etc. Hornady, in particular, makes bullets in these less common diameter, but others do too. And if many weights. I seem to recall a 7.65 Belgium Mauser using .311 bullets. Some bullets for the 7.7 Japanese were .314.

AND there are "ring dies" with which to reduce the diameter of larger bullets. Might be a trifle less damaging to the accuracy of the bullet. MIGHT!

The bullet making expert who loves to answer questions is Dave Corbin at corbins.com. He has his book on bullet making posted on the inet for review, download, study, etc. Help yourself. He has a brother in the same line of work who also takes questions, but they don't get along the best. Richard is at rceco.com. He has parts of his book on his web site... Luck, enjoy.
 
Posts: 519 | Registered: 29 August 2007Reply With Quote
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Thanks Guys.. Smiler

I have now some considerations in mind.


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Posts: 2805 | Location: Denmark | Registered: 09 June 2005Reply With Quote
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Jens,

Why don't you try the 308 bullets without anything done to them, and see how they shoot?

I have done that in the past in some odd caliber barrels, and apart from a change in the point of impact, everything seems to work just fine.


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Posts: 66765 | Location: Dubai, UAE | Registered: 08 January 1998Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Saeed:
Jens,

Why don't you try the 308 bullets without anything done to them, and see how they shoot?

I have done that in the past in some odd caliber barrels, and apart from a change in the point of impact, everything seems to work just fine.


Cool...

I`ll have a "go" on that one too.

Thanks Saeed. Wink


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Posts: 2805 | Location: Denmark | Registered: 09 June 2005Reply With Quote
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Hawk Bullets offers the 215's which are less than the Woodleighs.
I have tried some in my 303 double with good success.
Frank

.303 British (.311 dia.)

Spitzers
125 grains x .035 SPZ........$37.00 c3
180 grains x .035 SPZ........$39.00
215 grains x .035 SPZ........$40.50

Round Tips
180 grains x .030 RT..........$37.00 c3
215 grains x .030 RT..........$39.00 c3
 
Posts: 6935 | Location: hydesville, ca. , USA | Registered: 17 March 2001Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Frank Martinez:
Hawk Bullets offers the 215's which are less than the Woodleighs.
I have tried some in my 303 double with good success.
Frank
.303 British (.311 dia.)

+1
Good Bullets


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Posts: 4593 | Location: TX | Registered: 03 March 2009Reply With Quote
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I have been bumping up bullets, both plain lead alloy cast bullets and/or jacketed cup & core ones, for use in both hunting and competition for the past 15+ years. It has always worked well for me. I have not tried bumping up complex bullets such as the Fail-Safe.

Though different bullets may have different jacket material, jacket thickness, etc., bumping dies are also adjustable if correctly made. Sometimes it may take a bit of fiddling, occasionally a lot of fiddling, but usually the bullets can be made to come out just as the user would wish in terms of consistent performance when fired from the specific rifle for which they are intended.

One caution I would give to the new "bullet-bumper-wannabe", though, is that sometimes the difference between a great performing bullet and a poor performing one is an almost infintesimally small adjustment in the die.

So, once a good "combo" of die settings has been found for a particular bullet and rifle, the smart user probably leaves the die set up exactly that way, for that rifle, until wear and tear or the need to reform a different "lot" of bullets makes change absolutely required. It is often not good enough to just write down the settings in the belief that you can easily come back to them.

And, as that suggests, once you have found a die setting combo that works, it is often desirable to run a several year supply of bullets all at once. (Hunting bullets are not all that fussy, but bench-rest match-winning competition bullets can be.)

Anyway, bullet bumping sounds a lot harder than it really is. IF you like to play with things and enjoy experimenting, it is almost as much fun as shooting.


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Posts: 9685 | Location: Cave Creek 85331, USA | Registered: 17 August 2001Reply With Quote
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I have killed a fair amount of game with Hawk bullets in my 9,3x74R and my 450/400 3 1/4".

They are some of the best hunting bullets that I have ever used.


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Posts: 16134 | Location: Texas | Registered: 06 April 2002Reply With Quote
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jens poulsen, might I ask why you particularly want to use such a heavy bullet in your 303? Just interested. (I shoot 225gr cast in mine and have switched to paper patching bullets - more fun. I haven't gotten the recipe correct yet but when I do I will be shooting them at normal 303 velocity. Well, I have the mold set-up but I haven't had a chance to cast enough for testing).


Regards
303Guy
 
Posts: 2518 | Location: New Zealand | Registered: 02 October 2007Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by 303Guy:
jens poulsen, might I ask why you particularly want to use such a heavy bullet in your 303? Just interested. (I shoot 225gr cast in mine and have switched to paper patching bullets - more fun. I haven't gotten the recipe correct yet but when I do I will be shooting them at normal 303 velocity. Well, I have the mold set-up but I haven't had a chance to cast enough for testing).


Hey .303Guy.

The mauser I have would tear the paperjacket of when repeting with paperpatched. Papaerpatched are good when shot out of a singleshot rifle.
I have always like heavy bullet for the caliber. Nobody but myself says it has to be 215grain...hahaha. The thing is, it so difficult here to find bullets in .311cal.
The rifling in the barrel looks new cut, so I`LL try what Saeed suggested..why not a 308cal bullet to start with? Nothing can happen really.
I know I could shoot gaschecked hardcast bullets. The velocity that I am looking for is around 2200Ft/sec anyway. All in all in the end, it all depends of the sights which the rifle was regulated for, for which I don`t know yet Wink.


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Posts: 2805 | Location: Denmark | Registered: 09 June 2005Reply With Quote
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quote:
Nobody but myself says it has to be 215grain...hahaha.
Nothing wrong with that! So it's not a Lee Enfield. When you mentioned 215gr I just thought 303 Brit. I thought of trying 220gr 30cals but did not find a good enough excuse to 'need' them. Wink If someone would let me have a few for testing, though .... Big Grin

By the way, tracing paper is pretty tough stuff.


Regards
303Guy
 
Posts: 2518 | Location: New Zealand | Registered: 02 October 2007Reply With Quote
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