I know nothing about bullet swageing. Would appreciate info as to what is required, cost, etc.

Take a look at Dave Corbin's web site, there's lots of good info there.

http://www.corbins.com/index.htm

Depends entirely on what you are wanting to make.

I swage lead bullets for paper patching.
I swage jacketed bullets and half jacketed bullets.
I also swage bullets from spent brass cases of other cartridges.

All of these can be done with varying success using a variety of dies. Just depends on how professionally finished and precise you need your bullets to be.

Here is where you will find everything you need to know:
https://castboolits.gunloads.c...splay.php?41-Swaging

My interest was for economical bullets. Equipment costs looks like that would not happen. I do cast bullets and savings has paid equipment costs. There are some that try to make bullet casting rocket science and all the unneeded whistles and bells they buy makes it cost ineffective.

If you want to make some swaged jacketed pistol bullets on the cheap and you already cast bullets,
you can use the cast pistol bullets as the 'lead core' for making the jacketed swaged bullets.

Some may ask why go to the trouble of making another bullet from the cast lead bullet you already made..Good question.
If you want Jacketed pistol bullets instead of plain lead,,it's one way to get them and fairly easy and inexpensively.

44, 45, 38/357 are all easily made with a decent reloading press (good leverage).
You will need a few odd reloading dies/calibers Not in the above calibers but in rifle calibers generally for their bottle neck design which you use for the swage die to form the point on your bullet.

The cast bullet you already made is your lead core as mentioned.

Lastly you will need a couple different LEE push through sizer dies for swaging the formed bullet to final size. These are not expensive.

With this odd grouping and some range scrap brass in 40S&W cal as well as 9mmLuger, you can make your own jacketed pistol bullets.

Here's a link to a discussion from the CAstBullet Forum about using such equip.
The pics are gone but the description when read carefully walks you thru it.

Go down to the 9th posting in the thread..author Forrest r

https://castboolits.gunloads.c...45cal+pistol+bullets

quote:

Originally posted by carpetman1:
My interest was for economical bullets. Equipment costs looks like that would not happen. I do cast bullets and savings has paid equipment costs. There are some that try to make bullet casting rocket science and all the unneeded whistles and bells they buy makes it cost ineffective.

Not sure if they are available now.

But years ago you could buy bulk bullets from various makes very cheap.

I still have a few boxes of both rifle and pistol bullets.

They used to come in a plastic bag in a card box, at least 500 or 1,000 bullets in each.

This might be the way to go if they are available.

Saeed--I have used for years Remington or Winchester bulk packed from Midway. This was in .22 center fires and my .243. Invariably someone (with no experience) will say you have to use a PREMIUM bullet. If you are getting one shot kills, they must be premium in my books. Sorta like what is an assault rifle? A rifle used in an assault. Same same with a hammer.

Crud Ray.
I do some bullet swaging.
there was a time when jackets were like 8-10 cents each and you could duplicate 30 cent bullets.
it just took time and some trial and effort.

now... LOL
that first 10 cent bullet that looked and shot just like a good sierra bullet only cost me like 2 grand to pop out of the die.

I've done some for less, and others for more.

you can get a CH4D swage die for reasonable and knock some jacketed stuff out.
it just won't be for your 243, more likely for your 45 colt.
you'll still need jackets and a way to make cores, or buy wire and a cutter and a core swage die [mucho dinero]
a core mold isn't overly bad, but they will need to be swaged to weight too usually.

I've got off cheap using something like a 40 smiff case and a 180gr. 38 cal mold.
a core seat die and a point form die to make 44 mag bullets.

I had the mold.
the cases were free.
the 2 die set was about a grand AIRC.

it took some time annealing the cases then cleaning them.
then the casting time.
the two handle pulls, and cleaning the cases off again.
then adding a cannelure to crimp into.[more money, but necessary too]

I got all winter to make a bunch up.
my B-92 and Win. 94 trapper really doesn't shoot anything else as good as it does those bullets.
but I also had the die made a scosch over 430 with them in mind.


would I get into it again?
no.
am I glad I'm into it now.
yeah, but it really is another hobby just like casting is.
and when you shoot that nice group, or kill a deer with a bullet you worked up from scratch [changed the core alloy/bonded it to the jacket/changed the tip] it really is a good feeling.

is it better than store bought?
subjective, and your limited by the jackets you can get your hands on, or want to pay for.

I enjoyed swaging some years back when I had Corbin equipment.
Just for the record: When hydraulic or mechanical pressure is used to expand the diameter of lead or other materials, it is called swaging.
When hydraulic or mechanical pressure is used to reduce the diameter of lead, or a jacketed bullet, it's called drawing.
Swage up, draw down -- it's in Dave Corbin's book.

Bill/Oregon--Along the same lines of drawing down and swaging, many bullet casters refer to melting wheel weights into ingots as smelting. It is not. Smelting is a process to remove lead from ore and I think chemicals are used. Wheel weights it's simple remelting.

Lamar is right, it is getting harder to make it a viable hobby. Just research jacket and soft lead core availability. If a guy was adamant about getting into it I would suggest just doing .224 bullets from 22 jackets and maybe pistol bullets. You dont need a swaging press for those. But even doing the little .224 bullets on the cheap is time consuming. And the thin jackets are quite limited velocity wise.
Corbin had to put their "R" dies for a reloading press out of production because they are so far behind. But I believe BT sniper still makes them.
I have a 6.5 die on order with Corbin and it has been nearly a year.

quote:

Originally posted by Bill/Oregon:
I enjoyed swaging some years back when I had Corbin equipment.
Just for the record: When hydraulic or mechanical pressure is used to expand the diameter of lead or other materials, it is called swaging.
When hydraulic or mechanical pressure is used to reduce the diameter of lead, or a jacketed bullet, it's called drawing.
Swage up, draw down -- it's in Dave Corbin's book.

Not so, this quote from Wikipedia but many other sources also define forcing something through a die to reduce the diameter or cross section as swaging:

"As a general manufacturing process swaging may be broken up into two categories:

The first category of swaging involves extrusion of the workpiece, forcing it through a confining die to reduce its diameter, similar to the process of drawing wire. This may also be referred to as "tube swaging".
The second category involves two or more dies used to hammer a round workpiece into a smaller diameter. This process is usually called "rotary swaging" or "radial forging"."

Eagle forward that to Dave Corbin and see what he thinks. I would be curious. I no longer have the books.

I don't think if I swaged a bullet and killed a deer with it, it would mean anymore to me than if I used store bought. I have posted about shooting a spike buck with a cast bullet in .243 and the deer ran off. If it had been successful, so what? People have been taking game with cast bullets for years. Almost all the game I have killed and same with all the youth that I have taken hunting have used my reloads and I don't give that much consideration.

quote:

Originally posted by Bill/Oregon:
Eagle forward that to Dave Corbin and see what he thinks. I would be curious. I no longer have the books.

Dave has quite a good website with terminology etc. I don't see anywhere on the site where he states what you said 'just for the record : .........'

His descriptions of his various dies and sequences show that a piece of lead or jacketed bullets are 'squeezed' for want of a better word into a smaller shape where excess lead is bled off via bleed holes in the die or via the open point of a bullet jacket.
This is consistent with all other descriptions of swaging some of which I quoted in my earlier post. Even crimping where a fitting is squeezed down to grip and seal a pipe/hose or wire can use the term swaging. Crimp a fitting or swage a fitting, both correct usage of swage.

Google swaging, you'll find overwhelming agreement that it is a term (originally from French) to describe reducing, squeezing, hammering, etc, a workpiece into a smaller diameter.

Drawing is the term more describing the mechanical action of moving workpieces into place or pulling them through dies or over mandrels in dies where they are swaged.

From Discover swaging by Dave Corbin. Pg 171

"While swaging is the process of expanding the diameter of a lead core and jacket by pressure on one or both ends, drawing is the process of reducing the jacket, core, or bullet diameter by pressure against one end and the sides".

In other processes swaging can mean other things, it is basically using a tool to bend or form cold metal. But in the bullet making industry Bill's terminology is correct.

Back to this topic.

Depending on the diameter of bullet one is wanting, swaging bullets from spent cases is quite straightforward and can be done very inexpensively.

What I'm working on now is a bullet for my 11.2X72 Schuler, needing a .440" bullet.
Spent 7.62X39 brass is nominally .445" so, after cutting and filling with lead, I've rounded the nose with a .450 swaging die and pushed them through a Lee .442 die I already had.
The nose rounding is not even necessary though.
I'm ordering a .440" die for the final sizing.

This is the same technique I employ in making .423" bullets for my 10.75X68 from 40S&W or 10mmm brass except I use a 303 British FLS die to size those.


10.75X68 cartridge - 10.75 bullet made from 40S&W - 11.2 bullet from 7.62X39

I got my .440" die this week so did the final push through to size the 11.2 bullets.
I ended up beveling the rim portion to get them down to 400gr.
In the future I'll make them a bit shorter and keep the rim in normal form, they don't have a lot of parallel length and I'm needing to add more neck tension than I should need.
Ultimately, I think a 300-350gr bullet will be best because the 400gr intrudes a lot into the case which is one of the faults of the 11.2X72 Schuler cartridge as they were built up on standard length actions so the limited overall cartridge length necessitates the bullet seated farther into the case than most.
Should be a real thumper once I figure out what the best powder will be. I'd like to run some lower powered loads as well so 4198 may be my choice there.

Made my 350s today - much better!
I refined the process and now have very consistent very good looking bullets for the 'ol Schuler!!

Very nice! They look a lot like my pistol and 458 pills in the nose. I make those with an old CH reloading press set.

After waiting over a year I finally got my 7mm dies. I now have almost everything I need to make my own 7mm bullets nearly identical to Sierra Matchkings. They have an 8s tangent ogive for higher than average BC and rebated boat tail. I just need to make a punch for swaging the cores.
FWIW Dave Corbin is officially retired. He sold the business and no longer runs Corbin. Im done buying swage equipment anyway. Once I retire I may try making a few more dies of my own.

A lot of people have been powder coating cast bullets and running them at velocities unheard of before.

Powder coating just a plastic jacket.

Huvius,
I'm jealous! I built a 11.2x60 shuler. I was thinking about how x39 brass could be used, but had no way of doing it.
Would you sell me a half dozen of your bullets to try out?
I have a few boxes of woodleigh 400 grn stashed away. A box of Hawk 350 grn, but are very soft.
I have a RCBS 43 mauser mold profile, 385 grn, but in a .439 size. They drop right at .440
I should try powder coating those.
I have a couple 10.75x68's. I swage down 300 grn 44 mag bullets for practice shooting. Woodleigh 347's for hunting. Shot a couple moose with those.
Anyway, great work on the bullets, should I save my berdan x39 brass for you, or do you have plenty?
If you ever want to build an 11.2x60, I have the reamer. Turn the belts off 458 brass, reduce the head and your good to go!