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I know that lore would lead us to believe that if there is a one gun for everything under the sun out there…it is the 375H&H. And I would never want to suggest that the H&H isn’t a good choice, but in reality, isn’t a 9.3x62 just as effective? I mean if you were to pick one and go with it, couldn’t you get the same results out of a 9.3x62 that you could get with a 375? You can range from 3 feet to 300 yards with a 9.3 and shoot everything from crows to elephants…Factory loaded ammo is probably easier to get for the 375, but what with reloading components being as available as they are, you aren’t really loosing out on anything…So is it fair for me to compare the 375 with the 9.3? Is the step up to the 375 really necessary if I am happy with my 9.3? What would I gain? Thanks, Brian "If you can't go all out, don't go..." | ||
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Friend of mine who's rather a noted shooter and hunter took an armload of rifles to Africa the first time he went. Everytime he's been back since, he's just taken a .458. You can always download a rifle but you can only upload so much. Depends on what you plan to mostly hunt as to where you land on the power curve in an "allrounder". | |||
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http://www.municion.org/VomHofe/9_5x66SE.htm I would say that the 9,5x66 V.H.S.E. is the "all arounder" and legal for DG in all african countries. the predecessor to the 375 Ruger and 375 Dakota the VHSE is able to push aroung the 350 and 380 grain super heavy 375's at decent speeds and can fit in a smaller action. 577 BME 3"500 KILL ALL 358 GREMLIN 404-375 *we band of 45-70ers* (Founder) Single Shot Shooters Society S.S.S.S. (Founder) | |||
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You're losing a little bit of energy to the 375 H&H, but the 9.3X62 does have better sectional density, and according to boddington, better penetration. I think it's a great all around rifle, but I do think it's a bit on the light side for eles. I also believe the 375 H&H is also a little light for eles, but with a well placed brain shot, the 9.3 has plenty of penetration. A good all arounder, but I'd take a 458/470/417 etc. if your going after eles and cape buff on your hunt. A 458 Lott and a 9.3X62 would be a great 2 gun African combo.  "Sometimes nothing can be a pretty cool hand." 470 Heym; 9.3x74r Chapuis, Heym 450/400 on it's way | |||
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you can match S.D. in 375 to any 366 aka 9,3 320 grain 9,3 = 341 S.D. 380 grain 375 = .386 S.D. 350 grain 375 = .356 S.D. 577 BME 3"500 KILL ALL 358 GREMLIN 404-375 *we band of 45-70ers* (Founder) Single Shot Shooters Society S.S.S.S. (Founder) | |||
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Yeah, I assume they hadn't yet made those heavier bullets for the 375 when Boddington made the comment. However, I believe when comparing the typically used bullet sizes for both cals, the 286 grained 9.3 and 300 grained 375, the 9.3 has the advantage on S.D. (certainly could be wrong here, just what I've read). All and all though, the 375 obviously has a power advantage over the 9.3X62/74r, but both of these 9.3's do make excllent all-around rifles as the germans, and others, in Africa have clearly proven over the last century. But, as I said before, neither the 9.3's nor the 375 should be considered stopping rifles for ele and cape buff even though they both could get the job done on either animal. I, personally, would not feel comfortable hunting elephant with a 9.3. When it comes to cape buff, I'm still on the fence.  "Sometimes nothing can be a pretty cool hand." 470 Heym; 9.3x74r Chapuis, Heym 450/400 on it's way | |||
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You can load the 9.3x62 to right at 2500 with a 286. Factory .375 300's are often just under 2500. Who thinks a cape buff can tell the difference in 14 grains of deep penetratin bullet? A shot not taken is always a miss | |||
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You pose an interesting question. How big a difference can it make, when your bullet is just nine hundredths of an inch smaller in diameter, a dozen or two grains lighter in weight, a few hundred feet per second slower in velocity and several (say 5-700) foot pounds less powerful in energy? IMHO, if we were talking about the difference between the killing power of a couple of true, bone breaking and muscle mashing big bores, say, of .50 caliber or better, when used against what might turn out to be some pretty ornery, worst case wounded, vindictive and generally pissed off DG, it wouldn't be a big deal. Hell, there's power to spare there. But we are talking about the difference, or at least I think we are, between the killing power of a couple of minimally, and some might say questionably, but most would agree generally, effective medium bores, when used against what we must assume will turn out to be some pretty ornery, worst case wounded, vindictive and generally pissed off DG. Any difference, no matter how incremental or seemingly minimal, might, just might, be important in the latter scenario. That's why I would, on general principles and assuming my instinct of self-preservation had managed to kick in, choose a .375 H&H Magnum over a 9.3x62mm in such situations. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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Apples to apples the h+h wins but I think the reasons for each caliber are different. If you want a stopper I am with mrlexma and want over 1/2" Who today goes without a PH with a stopper gun for DG???? It is all a matter of prefference and style. Reload, Shoot and Repeat often  577 BME 3"500 KILL ALL 358 GREMLIN 404-375 *we band of 45-70ers* (Founder) Single Shot Shooters Society S.S.S.S. (Founder) | |||
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IMO - if you are happy with 9,3 you don't need 375 - goes vice versa aka - if you are happy with 375 you don't need 9,3 - I posed the same question to Gordon and Glenn down at Senuko - and they gave me the above - I can live with that (I am not comfortable in the presence of eles no matter the caliber tho - but thats another story  ). | |||
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I believe that's nine thousandths of an inch.....but who's counting anyway. /////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////////// "Socialism is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy, its inherent virtue is the equal sharing of misery." Winston Churchill | |||
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Thanks for the replies. I apreciate the information. I can't see where I really gain anything if I go with a 375 over a 9.3. If I really needed a big bore...a 375 is light for that work. I speak from limited personal experience here as I have only shot one ele and it was with a 375. It worked, I am still breathing, none the worse for wear, but in truth, I would have felt safer with something bigger. Like say a 450 NE #2 on a Pedersoli hammered double. I know that a 9.3 isn't ideal for the big and nasty, but it will work, probably as well as a 375 and I am really looking for something to use as an all-arounder - which mostly means it will account for whitetail deer and the occasional pig, etc. If I am lucky I will get to take 4 or 5 more ele and maybe three to five buff in my life. And rest assured, I will be looking at something bigger for that job (450...) but I don't think I would be necessarily undergunned with the 9.3, if that is what happened to be in my hands at the time...It isn't ideal, but it will get the job done...and at the end of the day, isn't that all we are really looking for? Thanks, Brian "If you can't go all out, don't go..." | |||
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It makes more sense to get a .416 or .458 as a step up from the 9.3. I have both a 9.3 and a .375 because in some places there is a legal minimum caliber of .375. In those cases I prefer a .375 as a back up to the larger bore rifle rather than a 9.3, although he 9.3 is s lighter package to carry and holds more rounds (at least versus my .375). Edit: Just to be clear, I am not suggesting a .416 or .458 as an all-around rifle. Rather, I agree that the step up from 9.3 to .375 is not that large and if you want to step up from 9.3 I think a bigger step is better, minimum caliber laws aside. ------------------------------- Some Pictures from Namibia Some Pictures from Zimbabwe An Elephant Story | |||
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All true, but the question was about a real all-rounder, not just an African allrounder. If I wanted a reasonable caliber hunting rifle, considering that I will hunt 80-90% in Europe, but still like to get to Africa and perhaps to Canada or Alaska with the same rifle, a 9.3x62 made a lot of sense to me. If I'd prefered varminting or alpine hunting, I'd probably consider a .270 the true allrounder. I know it's subjective, but shooting Roe Deer using .375 is considered not done by my local hunting companions, 9.3 is considered OK when using a though bullet. In fact THE allround-caliber doens't exist. You have several classes of allrounders, depending on what you like. 9.3x62, 9.3x64, .375 H&H, 9.3x74R, ... all are calibers delivering much payload without the recoil and bulk of a real DG-caliber rifle. Many will consider the .30-06 and the range of comparable calibers to be the real allrounders, and if you exclude the smallest and largest species, the are right! Some will say a true allrounder is a .416, or a .458, and from their perspective, they're probably right too! So the allrounder must be chosen from your own hunting perspective. | |||
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Oops! Thanks for the correction. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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I'm one of those fellas that doesn't mind the recoil of the .416 caliber rifles. I don't feel it at all when there is game under the sights. I like the 9,3x62 because the rifles are light and handy. I have not been impressed by the difference between the .375 H&H and the 9,2x62 on game. Both seem to work about as well. The .416s do seem to me to hit considerably harder ... but there are a lot of folks that will challenge that. I had two .375 rifles. Gave one of them away and acquired a second 9,3x62. Will keep the M70 SS Classic in .375 H&H just in case. May use it for piggie hunting from time to time, or as a backup rifle for travelling. Mike -------------- DRSS, Womper's Club, NRA Life Member/Charter Member NRA Golden Eagles ... Knifemaker, http://www.mstarling.com | |||
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Yeah, it doesn't make a lot of sense to own a 9.3X62 and a 375 H&H at the same time. Stepping up to a Lott or 416 seems more logical. That being said, I have at one time owned a 9.3X74r, 9.3X62 (though breifly), 375H&H, and a 416 remy. I've sense changed that up a bit and got rid of the 9.3X62, but redundancy is only a problem if you have a problem with it. It could be argued that a 416 makes a 375 useless, or that a 458 L0tt makes a 416 useless, and so on (for handloaders), but it basically boils down to having what you want and not what you necessarily need. It's similar logic to someone like myself owning a chapuis 470 nitro. I'll probably only use it on game that it's really meant for a few times in my life, but I spent as much on that gun as nearly all my "deer rifles" combined. Like I said, if you want to use the 9.3 instead of the 375, or if you want both, go for it. You only live once and when you die you can't take your cash with you.  "Sometimes nothing can be a pretty cool hand." 470 Heym; 9.3x74r Chapuis, Heym 450/400 on it's way | |||
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it doesn't make a lot of sense to own a 9.3X62 and a 375 H&H at the same time!!! What kind of a statement is that for a forum dedicated to rifle nuts? I have a pair of .375 H&H's, a 9.3x62, and I will surely build a .375 Ruger before I make my last stalk in the woods. If what we did was only have practical rifles, we'd all have a .223, .30-06 and a .375, nothing else. A shot not taken is always a miss | |||
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Same here (except for the getting rid part...). I never said you shouldn't own them all, just that the step up from 9.3 to .375 is not much and a jump to .416 or .458 makes more sense, if you are trying to increase the BHP. ------------------------------- Some Pictures from Namibia Some Pictures from Zimbabwe An Elephant Story | |||
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I agree. I think a 9.3 and 458 Lott is a perfect combo. You can load the Lott with 400 grain bullets at 2300 fps plus, or shoot the 510 grain bullets at 2,200 fps plus. The 9.3 would work great for PG and in a bind, or accidental run in with a great cape buff, it would work well enough. I got rid of my 62mm b/c I had a 74r and a 375 H&H. I also have a 338 win mag, 458 Lott, 470 nitro and a 416 remy. I can't take them all to Africa, although I wish that wasn't the case. Of course, the 9.3's make great deer, elk,pig, and bear guns as well. You've got most of Africa and all of North America covered with either a 375 or a 9.3. "Sometimes nothing can be a pretty cool hand." 470 Heym; 9.3x74r Chapuis, Heym 450/400 on it's way | |||
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I have used both on Buffalo and if I had a good 9.3x62 that I liked then I would be satisfied with it and see little need for a .375. If I was going to purchase a rifle of that sort then I would opt for the .375. I think its a bit better. I sold all the 9.3s that I had, mostly because my old .375 was around and I liked it better. I doubt if anyone can tell much difference in any of the big bores if the shot is in the right place, they all seem to kill pretty much the same... Hope I don't get gilflurted and stringhaultered by the big bore boys on that statement.  Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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The X62 is all the rifle you need for big game hunting anywhere, excepting Elephant...if you are a decent shot. That said, I have one, and a 375H&H, and a 416 Rigby, and a 505 Gibbs, and the 550 is ready to shoot in the morning, and the 577BME will be a go by Thanksgiving week, and... Rich DRSS Knowledge not shared in knowledge lost... | |||
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I agree that it is capable of taking anything, but it's certainly not a stopper. That's why I'm on the fence as to whether I'd personally take it on a buff hunt, of course that applies to 375's as well. I'd feel better hunting with a 458 Lott. I know all the arguements about shot placement etc., but just as most folks don't feel comfortable hunting ele with 257's, I'm not sure I'd feel particularly safe hunting buff with a 9.3X62. However, if you have complete confidence in your guide and in your shooting, the 9.3 is plenty for cape buff and does have the penetration capacity for elephant. Also, if you have a gunbearer that's not likely to jet when the hunt gets heavy, then carrying both a stopper and a 9.3 is a good option. But, how often can you count on the gun bearer really not bolting under pressure?  "Sometimes nothing can be a pretty cool hand." 470 Heym; 9.3x74r Chapuis, Heym 450/400 on it's way | |||
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Perhaps the greatest "all round" caliber is the 30-06. The 9.2x62 is a 30-06 on steroids. It is the go anywhere, do anything caliber; the rifle you can use for plains game in areas where dangerous game roam when a 30-06 is a bit too small. The 375HH is a great all round cartridge in Africa, but a little much for white tails. The 9.3x62 doesn't have the "over kill" of the 375HH on the low end, but is adequate on the high end. I'd rather have a 404 or 416 or even a 458 when hunting buff or elephant, but if one threatened while we were hunting something else, you'd have something that would be more adequate than a 300 mag or even a 338. It is my "go to" rifle for every trip. Kudude | |||
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FYI, the 338 win mag has more energy past two hunsky than the 9.3 or 375, but inside the 200 mark is what really matters. I disagree that the 375 H&H is too much for deer. I do agree that the 9.3 is better, but the 375 H&H causes less meat damage than does a 270 magnum for example. If one can handle the recoil and shoot a 375 accurately, there is no reason not to use it on White tail, mule deer, elk, pigs, and black bear. In fact, it's good practice for those that plan on using their 375's in Africa at some point in the future. "Sometimes nothing can be a pretty cool hand." 470 Heym; 9.3x74r Chapuis, Heym 450/400 on it's way | |||
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.375 can of course be used on deer without causing excessive meat damage, even .458 Lott can. In fact, as long as we are not hunting varmints or small game for furr, there is no upper limit to wich calibers are suitable to hunt a species, as long as we tend to make our bullets heavier. We will indeed get much more damage if we try to get them faster! But gun nuts or not, There is still some vitue in trying to match your caliber to the the kind of game you are intending to hunt. Therefore, I believe YOUR allround caliber is one approriate to the game you hunt mostly, and useable for the other species in your hunting dreams. | |||
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Thanks for all the replies guys. I am going at lunch today to pick up my latest 9.3 from my FFL. It came in yesterday on the afternoon run. A CZ 9.3 FS that I purchased here from FOsteology off the classifieds. I am going to put a few down the barrel this weekend and then it is getting shipped right back off to AHR for a new wiser styled, three position wing safety and trigger. I am also thinking of having a ghost ring mounted to the rear bridge and a straight front post added. I am going to scope it with a Burris FastFire red dot mounted on the front bridge. All in all it should be a pretty effective round, rifle, you know...the perfect all arounder for me... Regards, Brian "If you can't go all out, don't go..." | |||
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Wham Slam Thank You ; How about a 30/378 or 338/378 ?. I'm fond of the latter for Africa , reach out before they get to you .  One mans treasure is another mans trash . Shoot Straight Know Your Target . ...  | |||
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I don't see the 9,3X62 as the "one gun for everything" gun. Then again, I don't see the .375 that way either. I think both guns are at their best when used in combination with a true big bore. I have both a 9,3 as well as a .375 and have really come to prefer the 9,3 because it makes up into such a nice light portable rifle. IMHO, within 150 yards or so where most dangerous game is shot, it will serve just as well as the .375. However, both rifles are on the light side for really large and dangerous game and I think they are at their best when used in combination with a larger bore like a .458 Lott, .470 NE, .505 Gibbs, or a .500 Jeffery that can be brought into play if things get sticky. Dave Dave DRSS Chapuis 9.3X74 Chapuis "Jungle" .375 FL Krieghoff 500/.416 NE Krieghoff 500 NE "Git as close as y can laddie an then git ten yards closer" "If the biggest, baddest animals on the planet are on the menu, and you'd rather pay a taxidermist than a mortician, consider the 500 NE as the last word in life insurance." Hornady Handbook of Cartridge Reloading (8th Edition). | |||
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make it half your Big Game arsenal, pair it with a 505 Gibbs and be ready for anything. JMHO, but I own both. Rich DRSS Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost... | |||
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Having been on just one African plains game hunt last May with a CZ 550 in 9.3 X 62, I think I would take a Ruger Hawkeye in .375 Ruger if I did the same hunt again. A little more starch, and flatter shooting. And I would sure get in a lot more practice from field positions. There's no question that bench testing FOR ME is no preparation for making accurate shots in the field. There is hope, even when your brain tells you there isn’t. – John Green, author | |||
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For me, if it had to be one gun, one load... it would be a Model 70, in 30/06 with a 220 grain RN, and sitting on top would be a 3 x 9 Leupold.. Life Member: The American Vast Right Wing Conspiracy Jan 20, 2009.. Prisoner in Dumocrat 'Occupied America', Partisan in the 'Save America' Underground Beavis..... James Beavis..... Of Her Majesty's Secret Service..... Spell Check Division "Posterity — you will never know how much it has cost my generation to preserve your freedom. I hope you will make good use of it." John Quincy Adams A reporter did a human-interest piece on the Texas Rangers. The reporter recognized the Colt Model 1911 the Ranger was carrying and asked him "Why do you carry a 45?" The Ranger responded, "Because they don't make a 46." Duhboy....Nuttier than Squirrel Poop... | |||
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One gun for everything, I agree a 30-06 with 220 gr. softs and solids. Not anything that I wouldn't hunt with that combo and feel reasonably well armed.. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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I'm sticking to my gun, which is a .375 H&H Belted Rimless Nitro Express Magnum, or whatever you care to call it. When you're at the margin of effectiveness, every little increment helps. Mike Wilderness is my cathedral, and hunting is my prayer. | |||
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 577 BME 3"500 KILL ALL 358 GREMLIN 404-375 *we band of 45-70ers* (Founder) Single Shot Shooters Society S.S.S.S. (Founder) | |||
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What if that '06 was a Springfield with a Lyman or Redfield aperture rear? There is hope, even when your brain tells you there isn’t. – John Green, author | |||
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I like your point...but just a little bit bigger is just a tad bit better yes? I know that there is no definitive "one gun" for everything...I would rather have a 450 or bigger double on hand when dealing with the big nasty beasts and I am really fond of the job my .223 bolt does on crows and coyotes. But for something in between those...it just seems that the 9.3 fits the bill. At least for me, I am going to give it a try and see. Thank to all for the repsonses. Brian "If you can't go all out, don't go..." | |||
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Couldnt agree more; the 9.3x62 is really a 35 whelen, more or less.
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Soooo the 35 Whelen is just as effective as the 375 H&H. My 338-06 has better ballistics than the 35 Whelen. Sooooo my 338-06 is nearly just as effective as the H&H.
No matter how much you dissect it. The real world paper ballistics don't lie. Now, telling the difference in actual field hunting experience.... So IMO. The 9.3x62 is not as effective as the H&H. The H&H is bigger and faster. But I would take a well placed shot from the 9.3 before a bad placed shot from the 375 anyday. | |||
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yessssssss young jedi, but the 9,3x62 has nearly a century of competent dangerous game killing experience behind it. Hard to argue with that track record. It sits in the record book right beside the 375H&H, not the best rifle for anything; but a pretty good rifle for everything! Rich DRSS Knowledge not shared is knowledge lost... | |||
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