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Deer & Pigs only .357, .41 mag, or 44 mag?
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Picture of Mike_Dettorre
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figure inside of 50 yeards.

What would your recommned in a DA revolver...is a 6 inch barrel enough?

Is 41 mag factory ammo rare these days? Don't see it much any more around here.


Mike



What I have learned on AR, since 2001:
1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken.
2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps.
3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges.
4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down.
5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine.
6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle.
7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions.
8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA.
9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not.
10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact.
11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores.
12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 100 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence.
13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances.
 
Posts: 9297 | Location: Loving retirement in Boise, ID | Registered: 16 December 2003Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Mike_Dettorre:
figure inside of 50 yeards.

What would your recommned in a DA revolver...is a 6 inch barrel enough?

Is 41 mag factory ammo rare these days? Don't see it much any more around here.


For availability, I'd get the .429 magnum. There's alot more DA revolver choices at better prices, ammo is more available on dealer's shelves, and lastly it leaves more DA revolvers in .41Magnum for we who are obsessed with the caliber. Big Grin

Seriously, with the .41Magnum I've taken vermin,varmints, antelope, mulie/whitetail/blacktail/axis/fallow/sitka deer, caribou, elk, a bunch of African plains game, and a P.O.'d old range cow. Loaded ammo is available from 170gr.JHC to 265gr cast. I think right now that Taurus is the only company that produces a .41Magnum DA revolver. S&W M57s,657s, and Ruger Redhawks are available on the used market but are somewhat pricey. Finding one in Kaliforniastan for PPT is difficult at best.

Hope I answered some of your questions with regard to the .41Magnum. If you get one, you'll probably like it. There's alot of us hard core .41Magnum guys around.


JOE MACK aka The .41FAN

HAVE MORE FUN AND GET THE JOB DONE WITH A .41

I am the punishment of God…
If you had not committed great sins,
God would not have sent a punishment like me upon you. (GENGHIS KHAN)



 
Posts: 403 | Location: PRK | Registered: 20 April 2003Reply With Quote
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Mike,

I used an M57 6" Smith in 41 Mag for deer hunting for a VERY long time. Bought it in 1967. Has always worked. Most distant kill was 124 yards with it. Factory 210 SP ammo is superb. (I have a 3" round butt 657 that I legally carry concealed while bow hunting.)

44 Rem Mag works fine too.

I personally think .357 is a bit light at range.

If you don't reload, 44 Rem Mag ammo is easier to find.


Mike

--------------
DRSS, Womper's Club, NRA Life Member/Charter Member NRA Golden Eagles ...
Knifemaker, http://www.mstarling.com
 
Posts: 6196 | Location: Charleston, WV | Registered: 31 August 2002Reply With Quote
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.44 magnum would be my choice out of the three. Without the perfect shot opportunity, I believe the .357 is woefully inadequate on big hogs. The .41 isn't far behind the .44, but the .44 would be my choice with heavy hardcast bullets........



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

Semper Fidelis

"Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time"
 
Posts: 13440 | Location: Virginia | Registered: 10 July 2003Reply With Quote
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I was visiting California a couple of months ago and my old local gun shop out there had two new Redhwks in .41 mag.......could they be producing them again? Guess I'll hop over to Ruger's website and see.

Oh, and a 6-inch barrel would be very good!



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

Semper Fidelis

"Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time"
 
Posts: 13440 | Location: Virginia | Registered: 10 July 2003Reply With Quote
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There are no fly's on the 41 mag it would be an excellent choice for your scenario that you described. I have a M-57 S&W in 41 Mag and I like it very much.


_____________________________________________________


A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink

Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened.
- Winston Churchill
 
Posts: 5062 | Location: USA | Registered: 11 March 2005Reply With Quote
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357 mag would work nicely 158gr @1500fps or a 180gr @1300 whichever your gun shoots better with. xtps are great. ive seen a remington semi jacketed hp used on deer with awesome effect. but then again ive seen deer hit square with a 300mag run a 100yds. any caliber you choose practice makes perfect.
 
Posts: 164 | Location: michigan | Registered: 06 August 2007Reply With Quote
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My choice would be the aforementioned Redhawk in either 41 or 44 Mag.


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Posts: 2596 | Location: Missouri | Registered: 04 January 2005Reply With Quote
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Without a doubt a 44 Mag would be the best choice. Bigger holes, ability to use 44 Special, and can be used on black bear also. Better bullet choices and weights. Single action or double action 5 to 7 1/2 inch barrel, which every you are comfortable with.


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Posts: 3142 | Location: Magnolia Delaware | Registered: 15 May 2004Reply With Quote
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Just checked the Ruger website and they are no longer producing the .41 in a Redhawk......

Deer aren't that hard to kill, but pigs are a lot denser and you need penetration. Get the .44 and load it with heavy hardcast bullets and it won'y let you down........



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

Semper Fidelis

"Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time"
 
Posts: 13440 | Location: Virginia | Registered: 10 July 2003Reply With Quote
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I would use the 41 on any animal and that includes Black Bear that I would use a 44 mag on. The 44 mag in the field doesn't give the impression of being much of a step up the ballistic food chain over a 41 Mag IMHO.


_____________________________________________________


A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink

Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened.
- Winston Churchill
 
Posts: 5062 | Location: USA | Registered: 11 March 2005Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by jwp475:
I would use the 41 on any animal and that includes Black Bear that I would use a 44 mag on. The 44 mag in the field doesn't give the impression of being much of a step up the ballistic food chain over a 41 Mag IMHO.


How true! I've taken more than a few black bear over 350 pounds with the .41Magnum as well as had one pointed at a grizzly in the Bob Marshall wilderness when I had my fly fishing interupted. If I need more horsepower, I skip to the .475 and .50 caliber handguns in my collection. I started off with a 6.5 inch S&W M29 way back. Then, I found the .41Magnum back in the '60s and .429 magnum fell by the wayside.


JOE MACK aka The .41FAN

HAVE MORE FUN AND GET THE JOB DONE WITH A .41

I am the punishment of God…
If you had not committed great sins,
God would not have sent a punishment like me upon you. (GENGHIS KHAN)



 
Posts: 403 | Location: PRK | Registered: 20 April 2003Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by jwp475:
I would use the 41 on any animal and that includes Black Bear that I would use a 44 mag on. The 44 mag in the field doesn't give the impression of being much of a step up the ballistic food chain over a 41 Mag IMHO.

I have heard is said that any animal hit with a .41 mag would swear it was a .44 mag.

The difference in diameter is not that much. .410 vs .429 The energy levels of the 41 are actually slightly greater than the 44 mag in some loads. The .41 has a flatter trajectory than the .44 and retains its velocity at distance better, too (with the same weight slugs).

Where the 44 has a natural advantage is that it can go up to heavier bullet weights. But in reality also, bullet manufacturers have produced more selections in bullet construction types, weights and shape both in slugs and in loaded ammunition for the 44 than for the 41.

Remember, believe only half of what you see and only one-quarter of what you hear. That goes double for what you find on the internet. Even from me. Even this advisory.

Lost Sheep
 
Posts: 308 | Registered: 02 February 2008Reply With Quote
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As far as I am concerned, the .41 and .44 are so close in performance as to not matter. But as stated it is the choice of boolits that hurts the .41. If you load your own it is no problem to find good boolits but factory loads just have little choice unless you go to custom loads.
 
Posts: 4068 | Location: Bakerton, WV | Registered: 01 September 2003Reply With Quote
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Originally posted by jwp475:
I would use the 41 on any animal and that includes Black Bear that I would use a 44 mag on. The 44 mag in the field doesn't give the impression of being much of a step up the ballistic food chain over a 41 Mag IMHO.



If he is going to buy a new handgun, why go with the 41 Mag with the limited supply of factory loaded ammo. Sure the 41 Mag is close in ballistics with factory loads. But the 44 Mag will shine with heavier bullets.
I have shot and owned a 41 Mag for several years, but it always left me wanting more.

There are two kind of 41 Mag people, ones that love them and those that could care less about them, I fall into the latter.

Also there must be a reason not many, if any gun manufactures still produce the 41 Mag.


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Posts: 3142 | Location: Magnolia Delaware | Registered: 15 May 2004Reply With Quote
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I too like that you can load heavier bullets in the .44 mag than the .41. The heaviest .41 mag commercial load that I know of is by Buffalo Bore and it features a 265 grain bullet -- you can get loads with 340 grainers in the .44....... I just like heavy for caliber bullets.

Not knocking the .41 as it was supposed to be a law enforcement round, and it would have shined in this capacity had it been more widely accepted!



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

Semper Fidelis

"Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time"
 
Posts: 13440 | Location: Virginia | Registered: 10 July 2003Reply With Quote
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I've used the 357 on deer. It works, but not as authoritatively as a 44 magnum or the 45 Colt. Given a choice I'd use it only on oven-sized pigs. As others have mentioned the 41 and 44 will serve on black bear, but only a thrillseeker will choose a 357 for such work. There are no flies on the 41 magnum but, with the exception of a couple Taurus revolvers, any pistol made for the 41 is also made for the 44. A 44 magnum is easier to feed in out of the way places and store-bought ammo and handloading components come in much wider variety. In the four to eight inch range barrel length affect sight radius and handiness more than anything else. If you intend to use iron sights then as much sight radius as you can arrange is a good thing; if you plan to use an optical sight barrel length has no effect on accuracy per se. Four maybe five inches is about right for a DA belt gun; most folks find a crossdraw or shoulder holster more convenient with longer barrels.
 
Posts: 1733 | Registered: 31 January 2006Reply With Quote
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The 41 mag is an excellent caliber that should not be overlooked. The 230 grain flat point hard cast from Buffalo Bore leaves the barrel of my 4" S&W at 1336 FPS. Now that's going to leave a mark. The 170 JHC from Buffalo Bore checks out at 1538 FPS now that is an excellent self defense load, since penetration is only a tad more than some of the 45 ACP hollow points and the 41s resulting wound is large due to the increased velocity.
The more I shoot the 41 the more I like it. The 44 Mag is for sure and certain the more popular round and the 41 mag is too often overlooked. For a new handgunner wanting a potent round for Deer sizes game the 41 mag offers this with a bit less recoil than the 44 mag


_____________________________________________________


A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink

Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened.
- Winston Churchill
 
Posts: 5062 | Location: USA | Registered: 11 March 2005Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by nordrseta:
I've used the 357 on deer. It works, but not as authoritatively as a 44 magnum or the 45 Colt. Given a choice I'd use it only on oven-sized pigs. As others have mentioned the 41 and 44 will serve on black bear, but only a thrillseeker will choose a 357 for such work. There are no flies on the 41 magnum but, with the exception of a couple Taurus revolvers, any pistol made for the 41 is also made for the 44. A 44 magnum is easier to feed in out of the way places and store-bought ammo and handloading components come in much wider variety. In the four to eight inch range barrel length affect sight radius and handiness more than anything else. If you intend to use iron sights then as much sight radius as you can arrange is a good thing; if you plan to use an optical sight barrel length has no effect on accuracy per se. Four maybe five inches is about right for a DA belt gun; most folks find a crossdraw or shoulder holster more convenient with longer barrels.


Exactly! My exact sentiments!



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

Semper Fidelis

"Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time"
 
Posts: 13440 | Location: Virginia | Registered: 10 July 2003Reply With Quote
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Don't over look the 45 Colt either, even bigger bullet diameter and can be loaded to meet the 44 Mag.

If I had a choice of the .357, 41 Mag, 44 Mag or 45 Colt, you can bet the 45 Colt would be my first choice.

I am in no way knocking the 41 Mag, it is a fine round, but not for me.


If you're going to make a hole, make it a big one.
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Posts: 3142 | Location: Magnolia Delaware | Registered: 15 May 2004Reply With Quote
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I too would take the .45 Colt over the other three options, but he didn't mention the .45 Colt as an option. But, I wholeheartedly agree that the .45 would be a better choice.



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

Semper Fidelis

"Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time"
 
Posts: 13440 | Location: Virginia | Registered: 10 July 2003Reply With Quote
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I know he didn't mention the .45 Colt as an option, but maybe he just over looked it.
Most people that are getting into handgun hunting over look the 45 Colt, because of the available loads being mostly cowboy action loads or light loads. There are option for the non-reloader in buffalo bore and cor-bon. And if the person is a reloader, the 45 Colt would give the best overall performance in my opinion.


If you're going to make a hole, make it a big one.
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Posts: 3142 | Location: Magnolia Delaware | Registered: 15 May 2004Reply With Quote
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a redhawk in 45 colt is nice if you can find one. shoot them cheap 45 acp bullets for practice.
 
Posts: 164 | Location: michigan | Registered: 06 August 2007Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by Whitworth:
quote:
Originally posted by nordrseta:
I've used the 357 on deer. It works, but not as authoritatively as a 44 magnum or the 45 Colt. Given a choice I'd use it only on oven-sized pigs. As others have mentioned the 41 and 44 will serve on black bear, but only a thrillseeker will choose a 357 for such work. There are no flies on the 41 magnum but, with the exception of a couple Taurus revolvers, any pistol made for the 41 is also made for the 44. A 44 magnum is easier to feed in out of the way places and store-bought ammo and handloading components come in much wider variety. In the four to eight inch range barrel length affect sight radius and handiness more than anything else. If you intend to use iron sights then as much sight radius as you can arrange is a good thing; if you plan to use an optical sight barrel length has no effect on accuracy per se. Four maybe five inches is about right for a DA belt gun; most folks find a crossdraw or shoulder holster more convenient with longer barrels.


Exactly! My exact sentiments!

Yet more proof that "great minds think alike" I guess. Cool
 
Posts: 1733 | Registered: 31 January 2006Reply With Quote
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The 45 Colt properly loaded is IMHO Higher on the ballistic food chain for sure and for certain beer


_____________________________________________________


A 9mm may expand to a larger diameter, but a 45 ain't going to shrink

Men occasionally stumble over the truth, but most of them pick themselves up and hurry off as if nothing had happened.
- Winston Churchill
 
Posts: 5062 | Location: USA | Registered: 11 March 2005Reply With Quote
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I have three 357 mags.In my Ruger Bisley I can load 200 gr. hardcast bullets.I have 6 Deer and 2 Blackbear that were all one shot bang flops.I have never shot a Pig with it ,but have never recovered a bullet from an animal I have shot with it either.I have shot a lot of Whitetails with handguns of differnt calibers and dont believe on Deer and Blackbear with the right loads the 357 is under powered.In Wi.I can get a half a dozen Doe tags if I want them .So I can try lots of differnt combos to see what works best."Im just sayin" OB Big Grin
 
Posts: 4372 | Location: NE Wisconsin | Registered: 31 March 2007Reply With Quote
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But .357s don't kick hard enough, OLBIKER! Cool



"Ignorance you can correct, you can't fix stupid." JWP

If stupidity hurt, a lot of people would be walking around screaming.

Semper Fidelis

"Building Carpal Tunnel one round at a time"
 
Posts: 13440 | Location: Virginia | Registered: 10 July 2003Reply With Quote
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Dang Whitworth,I knew there was a flaw somewhere with them 357`s!!!! Big Grin
 
Posts: 4372 | Location: NE Wisconsin | Registered: 31 March 2007Reply With Quote
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quote:
Is 41 mag factory ammo rare these days?



Not here in Idaho. The .41 Magnum is a very popular round 'round these parts. When I lived in Los Angeles, I never had any problem buying .41 Mag. factory ammo for my S&W 57 and Marlin 1894S. I reloaded but still bought some factory rounds.

Don't know what is available in California, now that the communist fascists have worked so hard to destroy the Second Amendment there. Mad

L.W.


"A 9mm bullet may expand but a .45 bullet sure ain't gonna shrink."
 
Posts: 349 | Location: S.W. Idaho | Registered: 08 January 2005Reply With Quote
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