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I'm not in my house yet, nor do I have my table built, and I'm already in need of additional wisdom. I'd like to start with some case prep to get some hands on of what is going to go into the art of reloading. I think this will help me realize where to put what on the table, final height, etc. Background to My questions: I asked a buddy if I could swing some of my brass by his set up to have him show me how he runs through his mode of operation. He has a lyman case prep center with an e-zee trim on one station, and told me how it is the bees knees, and there is an eBay adapter if you need for trimming a case the ezee trimmer doesn't include. Between his prep center and his Dillon progressive- je cranked out some serious volume- until I asked him "how do you gauge how long your brass needs to be?" As I never saw him measure... anything but how many rounds were in the coffe can. He said the length is pre set so you just can't screw it up. (I also saw him super glue in some primers in his 7mm brass saying federal brass sucks and that's just what you have to do with it after its preped.) My question- I'm looking for eventual repeatable precision. Is the lyman any good, or does everyone prefer a forster type trimmer? It seems to me an "eBay adapter" means lyman doesn't make it for a reason. Second does federal brass suck? Or is he overusing the primer pocket cutter? Third- it seems from the few chapters I've read in the abc's of reloading and the lee manual (lyman not here yet) trimming the case end should be relative to the shoulder, but it seems it's based off the overall length? Almost done- (despite my buddys attempts to buy his sonic cleaner) I ordered a brass case tumbler; corn cobedia, walnut shells (I'm familiar with from cleaning engine valves) or synthetic media? Lastly- crbutler, Caldwell a good brand for chronograph? And should I get a new buddy as a mentor? Thanks again. | |||
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 HA HA glues in the primers. Goood to question everything. Sounds like you buddie has some really strange reloading habits.I have a set of RCBS x die for .308 and I only trim the brass the first time to get all of it the same length. or to clean up the mouth of the case. when the case is fired in a chamber it stretches and after a few or several firings the brass will stretch and need to be trimmed. in the manual there is an OAL trim length for that caliber that is you trim length. I can only guess on the primers. My first thought is high pressure and the pockets are stretched. Do you know what the load is he uses ? Keep reading and re-read. Over use of a pocket reamer could cause loose primers. Wow find some one else and compare | |||
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You don't need a mentor now. Get busy learning your hobby again. WAY overthinking it. Read the manuals and listen to crbutler. _______________________ | |||
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Agree. Also, glueing primers in? My first thought, like hivelosity, is he's loading too hot. To me, primers that seat too easily are a warning sign. Subjectively, if the primer seats with very little to no resistance, I pitch the case. If it seats with some, but diminished resistance, I'll load the case, mark the primer with a sharpie and discard the case after I fire it that one last time. Brass is cheap. | |||
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Ya I would be cautious about learning much about "reloading" from that friend. And on the Caldwell, I went through three of them and could never get it to work decent. Mac | |||
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Generally, in reloading equipment, you get what you pay for. The only brand I would caution you about is Lee. They make some real turds. That said, as an experienced reloader, they make some real gems too. But separating the wheat from the chaff in Lee products comes with experience. I also echo the 'get a single stage first' sentiments. I have a Dillon 650, CoAx, and Rockchucker. Still use them all for the specific tasks for which they are best suited. Hunting: Exercising dominion over creation at 2800 fps. | |||
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Labradar seems the rage right now if you have the coin. The Shooting Chrony is the best budget option IMO. Caldwell stuff has never impressed me much. Great ideas poorly executed in China. Hunting: Exercising dominion over creation at 2800 fps. | |||
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Agreed, if on budget do the shooting chrony. When budget allows go lab radar and never look back. Mac | |||
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^^This^^ But first off, make sure you have a bench that is larger than you need, and make sure it is properly lighted. Expect it to shrink until you need a second, then a third. Member: Orange Gunsite Family, NRA--Life, Varmint Hunters' Assn., ARTCA, and American Legion. "An armed society is a polite society" --Robert Heinlein via Col. Jeff Cooper, USMC Caveat Emptor: Don't trust *Cavery Grips* from Clayton, NC. He is a ripoff. | |||
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Thanks again everyone. If youre open to it, I'm trying to finalize my table and wondered- when you folks are reloading do you mostly run everything from a standing or seated position? What is your table sequence? (Trim station, scale, press, powder, or prep, press, scale,etc?) Are there some things you do standing that you'd prefer seated but table height is a factor, or vica versa? Lastly, at the end of the day my hands are tired and a little arthritic- so I'm thinking power trimmer for case prep, but already bought some hand tools. (Debur, etc). Any experience with on the market powered trimmers? I'm open to the drill press idea- maybe that's the tech thought process, or something like the "world's finest trimmer" if the depth can be adjusted. Still in research and buy mode for various items and appeciate the check out this... or this... wisdom. Thanks and Happy upcoming thanksgiving to all. | |||
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I would invest in. 1) a used turret press. There a good compromise. 2) a quality case trimmer 3) a digital powder dispenser Mike  What I have learned on AR, since 2001: 1. The proper answer to: Where is the best place in town to get a steak dinner? is…You should go to Mel's Diner and get the fried chicken. 2. Big game animals can tell the difference between .015 of an inch in diameter, 15 grains of bullet weight, and 150 fps. 3. There is a difference in the performance of two identical projectiles launched at the same velocity if they came from different cartridges. 4. While a double rifle is the perfect DGR, every 375HH bolt gun needs to be modified to carry at least 5 down. 5. While a floor plate and detachable box magazine both use a mechanical latch, only the floor plate latch is reliable. Disregard the fact that every modern military rifle uses a detachable box magazine. 6. The Remington 700 is unreliable regardless of the fact it is the basis of the USMC M40 sniper rifle for 40+ years with no changes to the receiver or extractor and is the choice of more military and law enforcement sniper units than any other rifle. 7. PF actions are not suitable for a DGR and it is irrelevant that the M1, M14, M16, & AK47 which were designed for hunting men that can shoot back are all PF actions. 8. 95 deg F in Africa is different than 95 deg F in TX or CA and that is why you must worry about ammunition temperature in Africa (even though most safaris take place in winter) but not in TX or in CA. 9. The size of a ding in a gun's finish doesn't matter, what matters is whether it’s a safe ding or not. 10. 1 in a row is a trend, 2 in a row is statistically significant, and 3 in a row is an irrefutable fact. 11. Never buy a WSM or RCM cartridge for a safari rifle or your go to rifle in the USA because if they lose your ammo you can't find replacement ammo but don't worry 280 Rem, 338-06, 35 Whelen, and all Weatherby cartridges abound in Africa and back country stores. 12. A well hit animal can run 75 yds. in the open and suddenly drop with no initial blood trail, but the one I shot from 200 yds. away that ran 10 yds. and disappeared into a thicket and was not found was lost because the bullet penciled thru. I am 100% certain of this even though I have no physical evidence. 13. A 300 Win Mag is a 500 yard elk cartridge but a 308 Win is not a 300 yard elk cartridge even though the same bullet is travelling at the same velocity at those respective distances. | |||
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As far as sitting or standing I always prefer to sit if something is going to take any length of time. But since some operations require different height because of leverage or vision, I have a stool that is bar stool height as well as an office chair. Oh, and don't forget the good stereo.  Have gun- Will travel The value of a trophy is computed directly in terms of personal investment in its acquisition. Robert Ruark | |||
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one the of favorite things i got was computer seat that has a seat for your butt and a knee seat for my knees i don't know if you can get them anymore but it sure beats standing in front of the press on a cement floor............... | |||
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I started reloading rifle cartridges almost 30 years ago. Shopped the catalogs and bought a RCBS Master Reloading kit when I was 16. Still use all of those components today. Have added a progressive and another single stage Redding Ultramag, but prefer the rockchucker. I think the T7 Redding would be a good one. Shoot straight, shoot often. Matt | |||
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Plenty of good advice already given. And find a different mentor. I have a Lee handpress, a Rockchucker and a Co-ax, and an old Versamec 700 shotshell press. Lee is for days when I am out at the range testing stuff or not wanting to sit in the reloading room to process small batches of brass. RCBS press is a do all press, the first one I bought. The Co-ax was later, it is a Caddy of presses, but has its limitations with very small and very large cartridges. Shotshell press has been back in the box for 20 yrs +. Not worth doing anymore. Get as many reloading manuals as you can, each one has a little something different in it for tricks to process a cartridge, some have better pics than others,some explain certain details better. Plenty of info on You Tube, some good, some leaves a bit to be desired, some should not have been put up there. Most powder mfgrs and bullet mfgrs have websites with load data, some have very little, some have a lot. When it comes to bullets use the bullet mfgrs data to start with. Electronic scales have their foibles, use a beam balance in conjunction with it, until you learn what is going on with an electronic scale. Beam balance is a one time investment for a good one. Hand primer tools beat on press priming tools in feel on seating primers, and are portable to the range or a different part of the house. One case where Lee makes a good product, there are different ones out there, but they have some issues of their own as well, in how they are designed and how they are finished and how well they function. Dies are like shoes, whatever turns your crank.You will probably wind up with numerous brands and styles and features. They all offer much the same features, just promote them differently. Powder measures have their uses, but, their issues as well, handy in some circumstances, a pain in others. And they are portable if req'd. If you get into a lot of pistol rounds, a progressive is a practical step down the road, but, as others have said, learn what is what on a single stage first. Then you will know what to look for with issues on a progressive. Take a look at Cabelas super ultra RCBS kit, hard to beat what is in that kit for the dollar value to start with. You may change a few things out down the road, but, not much. | |||
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I would recommend a single stage press for a beginner or a 50 year experienced reloader for loading rifle ammunition.. I still have my first single stage press, a massive Hollywood press I found in the Marfa Texas dump ground and cleaned it up, Been offered $500 for it many times..I also have an RCBS A-1 and it will even load 50 BMG ammo if I switch the hole in the top...My third press is a a RCBS C press, that Ive never used, its under my bench somewhere.. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Joshb, you've gotten some great information. Although I have both a turret and a single stage press, I agree with Ray's recommendation of the single stage press. In my case, they make me pay more attention to details. I use Lee presses, RCBS powder handling tools (Lee powder scoops with RCBS 10-10 balance scale for trickling and now an RCBS Rangemaster 2000 digital scale to confirm throws). I use a Lyman tools for case prep (Universal Case Trimmer and Case Prep Center). My dies are RCBS, Lee and Redding but have been using Lee more over the past few years. I load for 10 different rifle calibers. Lots of good reloading equipment available these days and most of it works well and will allow you to hand load good, accurate ammo. Have fun reloading! It can be a rewarding, enjoyable hobby. Start young, hunt hard, and enjoy God's bounty. | |||
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I would keep as much distance from your friend so when he blows his head off using super glue to hold the primers in worn out brass, you don't get some of the shrapnel from his stupidity..That is incredibly dangerous.. All you need is a single stage press, a scale, a powder measure, a case trimmer, case holders for the calibers your going to load and some case holders will work for several calibers, the book will show you that..YOu need chamfers for your calibers, caliber pins for your trimmer in each caliber..I have a set of bullet pullers but you may or may not need them to start with ..Ive been reloading for almost 70 years, and have picked up stuff over the years at gun shows and wherever, mostly used stuff that doesn't wear..You can put your primers in the case with your loading tool as a rule or get an RCBS primer do hicky, I have one and I love it because it saves me so much time..A case cleaner is handy as can be, Most all my stuff is RCBS. Then you need case lube, the other stuff you can pick up as you learn. Keep your cases trimmed to proper length as long cases when fired will run pressures up big time. Ray Atkinson Atkinson Hunting Adventures 10 Ward Lane, Filer, Idaho, 83328 208-731-4120 rayatkinsonhunting@gmail.com | |||
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Just to illustrate on the point of the mentor gluing in primers. I have brass for my 32-40 and 32-30, that has only ever been breech seated, that have been De & re-primed over 300 times each. Primer pockets on them are just fine. I know of people who use 1 pc of brass in matches and practice, same thing, with many more cycles. If a primer is loose, it is the reloader at issue, not very likely to be the brass, if ever. A lot of people complain about manuals having lawyer loads in them. Actually, all they have is what is tested for the most part,some old manuals were not actually pressure tested.. Some of those have been tested with new equipt and been found to be a whole lot higher pressure than they "thought` they were at the time. Loose primers-- 99.9% of the time will mean you are just doing it wrong. | |||
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Just as crbutler said. You will always find a use for a single stage O frame press even after you move up to a progressive. I have the L-N-L Progressive and haven't had any trouble out of it and I have loaded quite a few thousand rounds with 9mm, 10mm 45acp and 38 Super all together. Basically any of the major O frame brands are fine. I have an RCBS Rock Chucker and a Lee Classic Cast press and use the Lee Classic Cast press the most for single stage, I even had my Piggy Back II on it until I bought the Hornady L-N-L. The Lee is even cheaper. I would not even want to be on the same range with your "Friend" when he shoots his glued together ammo. Steve.......... NRA Patron Life Member GOA Life Member North American Hunting Club Life Member USAF Veteran | |||
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