The Accurate Reloading Forums
Speer Grand Slam's
24 September 2001, 15:20
bulldogSpeer Grand Slam's
I worked up and shot rounds for my 7mm-08 with Speer 145 Grand Slam bullets. My end results are so-so, but can it get better? My question is; is crimping a option to shrink my groups? Right now I have not crimped anything, so it's new to me. I'm using Re19, CCI 200 primers in Rem. brass. It's either switch powder (IMR 4350 or H4350) or try crimping next. I'm not pleased with the Re19 as it leaves powder residue in the barrel and it takes more grains per shell than the other powders, so switching powder is no big deal. But if crimping can help I'll try it before going to another powder.
Bulldog...
24 September 2001, 16:52
ready_on_the_rightbulldog- I'm far from an expert, but I've never heard of crimping improving accuracy in rifles. I would play with the seating depth.
Back off of powder charge when getting closer to the rifling.
I like to start .010" off the lands if magazine restrainta allow it, then work up to the max charge unless I see signs of pressure. Then go with the acceptable charge and try shrinking the OAL a little(.05"-.015") to see if it improves accuracy.
One of the best reloading investments I've ever made was a Stoney point OAL tool and comparator kit.
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Victory through superior firepower!
24 September 2001, 17:25
jrslateBulldog,
I don't know about the 145 gr. grand slams, but I tried the 175 gr in my 7mm Rem Mag. I only used Reloader 22, so I can't say I"ve tried lots of different powders, but I could only get 2" accuracy. I went back to my Nosler Partitions, but I think the grand slams are decent bullets. I'll try more sometime, but I haven't found the time or need yet...
Joel Slate
Slate & Associates, LLC
The Safari Specialists
www.slatesafaris.com
25 September 2001, 06:25
bulldogI've already worked with different seating depths. I'm one grain above min. charge. The manual said to seat @ 2.775 and I went down from there (2.770 & 2.765). 2.770 works good for 1-1/4" groups. Good enough to hunt with, but I'm spoiled as my 140 NBT's shoot 1/2" or less. Maybe I'll just go with what I got, but just wanted to know if crimping was worth the trouble.
Bulldog...
25 September 2001, 06:35
AtkinsonI doubt that any bullet will compare to Nosler Bal. tips for accuracy, as for their game killing ability, school is still out on that one...I would try the Swift Sirocco, I have a hunch that might be a nice bullet for the 7-08 or 7x57...
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Ray Atkinson
ray@atkinsonhunting.com
atkinsonhunting.com
25 September 2001, 12:26
bulldogRay, I agree with you about the Swift's. The Noslers have not failed me yet, and the performance so far has been excellent.
Bulldog...
25 September 2001, 13:26
<Ol' Sarge>I've had pretty good luck with Grand Slams.
They don't shoot as accurately as NBTs, but they do go under an inch. Mine are set way out as my gun has a very long throat. There is 1/4 inch between the neck and the cannelure.
I started using 165 SGSs in my -06 about 20 years ago when they proved to be the penetration champs of over 10 bullets I tried, and that includes Noster Partitions!
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To be old and wise.....first you have to be young and stupid!
25 September 2001, 13:39
bulldogLooks like I might need to try seating longer. Guess its time to buy a stoney point OAL gauge. So far I had my best luck by going down. But with 1-1/4" groups so far, I don't think the deer will notice.
Bulldog...
25 September 2001, 13:56
fredj338Try switching to RL15, I have had good luck w/ it in my .308. As the others have said, play w/ the seating depth & see what you get.
25 September 2001, 17:02
bulldogJust cranked out 30 rds. of 140 NBT's. I know they'll shoot tight. Got to looking at the results on the Grand Slams and best 5 shot group was a little over a inch. Throw out the last round and I got 3/4". Good enough for deer hunting. Next time I pick up some powder, I'll try the H4350 next. So far the posts here show what I got with the G.S. is acceptable, so I'm not going to sweat over it. It looks as though everone gets good results with the Nosler's. The reason I wanted to try the G.Slam's is they look to provide a good punch on deer & hogs. I hate a bullet that does not pass all the way through. That's the reason I stopped using Core-Loks, great on does (lungshot) but had trouble staying together and punching out on those big bucks.
Bulldog...
26 September 2001, 08:52
<Ol' Sarge>Bulldog,
Now you may have to place your shots a little differently. I loaded the Speers specifically for bear and elk, then when I shot a big muley through the lungs he didn't go down right away. Something I was not used to. I kept shooting until he went down. Six shots later he fell.
Well, the first shot was lethal, it's just that neither me or that buck new he was dead yet.
Seems the construction of those GSs which help them penetrate also keep them from opening up much on lung shots. They just drilled holes through him. The exit holes were no larger than the entrance holes.
But then when I hit the off shoulder of a big elk the exit hole was huge and he went down pronto.
I think the ideal bullet would be somewhere between a Nosler Ballistic Tip and a Speer Grand Slam.
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To be old and wise.....first you have to be young and stupid!
26 September 2001, 11:58
bulldogSarge, I know what you mean. That is the reason I quit using the Nosler partitions. Little hole in, little hole out, no blood trail, found both that I shot but had the dicken's looking for them. I was hoping the Grand slams would be between the B.T.'s and the Partitions. What I do like about the NBT's is the very large exit wound. Plenty of sign to follow, but never had to go looking after the B.T. hit em.
Bulldog...
26 September 2001, 14:41
<Jeff Myhre>Bulldog, I haven't posted in a while, but here's what I would do. I have a Rem 788 chambered for 7mm-08, a very nice long range target rifle, anyway try Varget powder, CCIBR2 primers and bullets as close to the rifling as possible. Works really well for the Hornady 162gr. A-MAX match bullet.
Good luck Jeff Myhre
26 September 2001, 14:55
<Bill>One of the guys I was in Africa with last month was shooting a 7 rem mag with a 160 grand slam at about 3000 fps.
Performance was spectacular, he shot nine animals, with 8 one shot kills. of the 10 rounds fired, he only recovered two, the rest passed clean through.
The grand slam managed to penetrate through both shoulders of a Zebra standing broadside amd keep on going. I didn't think they would give taht kind of performance. The few recovered bullets retained thier weight and expanded well.
26 September 2001, 16:25
bulldogJeff, I have the same rifle. Mine has a 18-1/2" barrel. Love that gun and it's taken around 50 whitetails so far. Got a 700 ADL two years ago, and am working up most of my loads with it. Wanted to use the 788 with the Grand slams, but it does not seem to like them. Thanks for the recipe with Varget. I happen to have some for my 223. I'll try that load next. If I may ask, what manual did you get that load out of? By the way Jeff, my last name is Meyer, is yours pronounced the same?
Bill, thats good news to the performance of the Grand slams. How did the exit wounds look? I believe they will do the job on a Louisiana porker if I get the chance. I hope to try some on whitetails also.
Bulldog...
27 September 2001, 07:41
tom ga hunteri used 140 bal tips in my 7x57 til i got 2 straight craters on large hogs.. i changed to 145 speer flat bases and solved the problem.. i have a 280 that will shoot 145 gs pretty well but have not shot anything with that load..all that said i use hornady 154 flat base bullets in the 280 i hunt with most of the time--i think it is the best killing bullet for 7mm..i load to 2850 fps at the muzzel
28 September 2001, 02:57
<Sniper>quote:
Originally posted by Ol' Sarge:
I think the ideal bullet would be somewhere between a Nosler Ballistic Tip and a Speer Grand Slam.
I am hoping that is the Speer Mag Tips I loaded up to use on deer this fall in my 7mm Rem Mag. I hardly ever hear anyone refer to this bullet.
28 September 2001, 23:51
1894Indeed I agree that the Mag Tip is never mentioned. I thought the 160gr 7mm would be ideal as an allrounder for my 7x57. It is hot core for weight retention, double thickness shank for penetration and strategicaly weakened jacket by the tip for expansion.
I would be very interested in your experiences.
29 September 2001, 04:02
<Sniper>I'll let you know 1894. Probably be Nov-Dec before I get any on game info.
06 October 2001, 05:39
<.280 Sweden>I use the 160grs Grand Slam in my .280Rem,
good accurancy and "stopping power".
That bullet will be loaded for the moose hunt next week.
06 October 2001, 06:50
Rich AndersonI have used the grand slams as well as the mag tip in a 7x57 AI with good results for deer. My 7mm-08 like H4895 with the 145gr grand slam.
06 October 2001, 09:30
Terry BlauwkampA couple of people have mentioned the
Speer Mag Tip.
I have used the 175 gr Mag Tip a lot in the 7mm Mag, and just love it.
"Actually" the Mag Tip is a better bullet than the Grand Slam.
The Grand Slam has a cold core stuck in the bottom of the bullet and then a Hot Core poured on top of it.
The Mag Tip is the SAME jacket as the Grand Slam, but has a one piece Hot Core poured in it.
No separation of of cores on impact. I've shot a least 20 animals with it in Africa, and never a problem.
06 October 2001, 14:36
bulldogquote:
Originally posted by Rich Anderson:
I have used the grand slams as well as the mag tip in a 7x57 AI with good results for deer. My 7mm-08 like H4895 with the 145gr grand slam.
Rich, what gun do you have in 7mm-08?
Bulldog
06 October 2001, 20:04
<sure-shot>Bulldog, good powders for the 7mm08 pushing 140-145gr bullets are Hodgdon Varget, H4350, RL15 and Accurate Arms XMR4350. Avoid IMR4350, RL19 is a tad slow for the 7mm08. Using these powders you might try seating the bullet deeper contrary to popular opinion, sometimes a compressed load gives a more uniform ignition resulting in better accuracy. I'm seating bullets .060-.070 off the lands in a recent 7mm08 I put together, accuracy has been excellent with several brands of bullets which group under .5". I've had good results with Noslers and Hornadys in 7mms. The Swift Scirocco 150gr gave groups of .75" in my 7STW. Nosler 150gr BT gave gruops of .30" in same rifle. sure-shot
07 October 2001, 06:14
bulldogSure-shot, thats exactly what I did. dropped down 0.05 and got one holers using IMR4350 and Noslers 140 BT,s. The Grand Slams are going to get a different powder to see if it improves.
Bulldog...
07 October 2001, 06:27
<Boyd Heaton>Try H380.Work's in my 7-08 with all bullet's I've tried.
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My wife told me if I buy another gun she would leave me.I hope the door does not hit her on the way out!!!!!
07 October 2001, 13:27
remboGrand Slams are no different than any other bullets for accuracy. I shoot the 200 gr in my 300 Win into an inch for three shots and a friend can't get the 180 version under 2" in his 300 Win.They do work well on game however.
07 October 2001, 14:59
<sure-shot>Bulldog, you might gain a little more velocity switching to H4350. It's a little finer grain than IMR4350 which allows for a few more grains of powder if your load has not maxed out. Accuracy should remain the same if you play with the seating depth a little.sure-shot
07 October 2001, 15:47
bulldogSure-shot, I have not tried any H4350, but if it is finer grains that would be a plus as the only problem with the IMR4350 is running it through the powder measure. The grains get hung up and I'm cutting a few to get the charge to drop. I assumed you answered one of my many questions, that if I found a good seating depth, it would work even if I changed powders, etc. I always like to cross check my powder selection, as to maximize the use over a multitude of calibers. Just got another gun/caliber to cook a load up on. I might as well order all the die sets from RCBS at the rate I've been collecting guns.
Boyd, thanks for the tip on the H380. It may be what I've been looking for when I try to load some 'lite' grain bullets by Speer. Have you tried any of the 110 TNT's?
Bulldog...
[This message has been edited by bulldog (edited 10-07-2001).]
09 October 2001, 04:29
Rich AndersonBulldog my rifle in 7mm-08 is Weatherby's Ultra Light. I agree with the other gentelman on using the Hodgdon poeder vs IMR. I lean more to this brand as it does meter better.