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458 Lott cast loads-tested
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You have a good start on this. You just learned what different brand pc will do. I don't know if you have Harbor Freight up there, but stay away from their pc...not good.
 
Posts: 662 | Registered: 15 May 2018Reply With Quote
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I will try and shoot my 458 wm and 458 Lott again this Sunday. I have also got my lube press working and made some lubed bullets to try for the first time in the Lott.I will bring my chrono too as I have not used it in ages.I am also thinking of ordering and giving IMR 4227 a try.
 
Posts: 11651 | Location: Montreal | Registered: 07 November 2002Reply With Quote
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Shootaway you must have a very good lead/alloy supply, that's great if you do. Do you recover your bullet to melt down again? How hard is it to get the lead/alloy type wheelweights in Canada? Very tough down here in the states now. More and more are getting phased out.
 
Posts: 662 | Registered: 15 May 2018Reply With Quote
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I have no time and no place to melt my own lead-neither do I like the idea of exposing myself to it.I buy the stuff from a place in Ontario.I forgot the name of the place and I deleted all my emails by mistake a while ago.Last time I calculated how much I save and it wasn't much(45 colt ).I am lucky there is a shooting range not that far away, that lets me shoot lead cast.Hopefully I can continue to do so for a while.
 
Posts: 11651 | Location: Montreal | Registered: 07 November 2002Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
I have no time and no place to melt my own lead-neither do I like the idea of exposing myself to it.I buy the stuff from a place in Ontario.I forgot the name of the place and I deleted all my emails by mistake a while ago.Last time I calculated how much I save and it wasn't much(45 colt ).I am lucky there is a shooting range not that far away, that lets me shoot lead cast.Hopefully I can continue to do so for a while.


Oh my, LOL Okay first off melting lead doesn't put off hazardous vapors UNLESS YOU HEAT IT TO BOILING! That is a much much higher temperature then the normal casting range which is in the vicinity of 700 degrees F. Okay now as for touching lead. If you handle it enough you get that grey lead coating on your fingers. This isn't bad either UNLESS YOU ARE EATING SOMETHING THAT YOU HOLD WITH YOUR FINGERS AND INGEST IT...there's the key word INGEST. One should be wearing gloves to start with.

Alright if you don't use the proper alloy mix you're not going to get the TOP performance. I don't know about your Ontario place, but here in the states is a place called Roto Metals that has a large inventory of alloys that you can dream of. Yes if you're buying the alloy or bullets already cast there isn't much of a saving. Shootaway many of those guys over on Castboolits have been casting for decades. Many of them get a lead level test of how much lead is in there body. I'm probably not going to convince, but it would be a good idea to sign up over there and pose that exact question. I'll end with that you can save lots of money casting your own bullets especially if you salvage the lead alloys which one I mentioned is wheel weight.
 
Posts: 662 | Registered: 15 May 2018Reply With Quote
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This thread reminds me how much I love Missouri Bullets.


Don't Ever Book a Hunt with Jeff Blair
http://forums.accuratereloadin...821061151#2821061151

 
Posts: 7570 | Location: Arizona and off grid in CO | Registered: 28 July 2004Reply With Quote
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I went to the range yesterday.I had run out of AA5477 and used H4895 instead.That was a bad idea as I used too little of it and had misfires in both rifles and poor ignition.The cold weather did not help.All shot well at 50yds but very poorly at 100yds.The first round I shot out of my 458 wm shot perfect at 50yds-no keyhole like before.The old powder paint and using unsized bullets worked well.I tried to shoot a second round to confirm but it ignited poorly and got stuck in the barrel.It could not be easily removed so I had to pack it up.I will be receiving some AA5477 today.
 
Posts: 11651 | Location: Montreal | Registered: 07 November 2002Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
I went to the range yesterday.I had run out of AA5477 and used H4895 instead.That was a bad idea as I used too little of it and had misfires in both rifles and poor ignition.The cold weather did not help.All shot well at 50yds but very poorly at 100yds.The first round I shot out of my 458 wm shot perfect at 50yds-no keyhole like before.The old powder paint and using unsized bullets worked well.I tried to shoot a second round to confirm but it ignited poorly and got stuck in the barrel.It could not be easily removed so I had to pack it up.I will be receiving some AA5477 today.


When you say you used too little of that H4895 was there a large empty space left in the case and did you use a filler?
 
Posts: 662 | Registered: 15 May 2018Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by vzerone:
quote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
I went to the range yesterday.I had run out of AA5477 and used H4895 instead.That was a bad idea as I used too little of it and had misfires in both rifles and poor ignition.The cold weather did not help.All shot well at 50yds but very poorly at 100yds.The first round I shot out of my 458 wm shot perfect at 50yds-no keyhole like before.The old powder paint and using unsized bullets worked well.I tried to shoot a second round to confirm but it ignited poorly and got stuck in the barrel.It could not be easily removed so I had to pack it up.I will be receiving some AA5477 today.


When you say you used too little of that H4895 was there a large empty space left in the case and did you use a filler?


I dropped the usual charge by 2 grains.I would mostly shoot indoors and rarely had an issue-just here and there-one in a couple of hundred or more and I have shot about 3000 rds with the load.Yesterday was another story.I might try using a filler or increasing the charge when using that powder again.
 
Posts: 11651 | Location: Montreal | Registered: 07 November 2002Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
quote:
Originally posted by vzerone:
quote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
I went to the range yesterday.I had run out of AA5477 and used H4895 instead.That was a bad idea as I used too little of it and had misfires in both rifles and poor ignition.The cold weather did not help.All shot well at 50yds but very poorly at 100yds.The first round I shot out of my 458 wm shot perfect at 50yds-no keyhole like before.The old powder paint and using unsized bullets worked well.I tried to shoot a second round to confirm but it ignited poorly and got stuck in the barrel.It could not be easily removed so I had to pack it up.I will be receiving some AA5477 today.


When you say you used too little of that H4895 was there a large empty space left in the case and did you use a filler?


I dropped the usual charge by 2 grains.I would mostly shoot indoors and rarely had an issue-just here and there-one in a couple of hundred or more and I have shot about 3000 rds with the load.Yesterday was another story.I might try using a filler or increasing the charge when using that powder again.


What was the charge of H4895 in grains?
 
Posts: 662 | Registered: 15 May 2018Reply With Quote
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48grs of H4895
 
Posts: 11651 | Location: Montreal | Registered: 07 November 2002Reply With Quote
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Thanks, that's not to bad of a load. A filler will raise your pressure a tad and from the sounds of it you can use that. Make sure your filler fills the space from the top of the powder to the base of the bullet. Never make a wad of the filler on top the powder with air space between it and the bullet base. I'd like to see you use shotshell filler like Puff-Lon.
 
Posts: 662 | Registered: 15 May 2018Reply With Quote
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I shot the 458 wm yesterday.I shot powdered coat unsized using AA 5477 and the same H4895 loads I used from last outing-the ones that were not shooting.The first two rounds(AA5477) keyholed and all the rest shot fine.I don't know why the first keyholed.
The 458 Lott shot fine with coated and sized powder coated bullets at 50yds.Shooting the big bores cast was great practice.Shooting the Ruger and CZ together gave a good feeling and comparison between the two.I found the CZ with it's drop stock was easier to mount and aim or view the bullseye.
 
Posts: 11651 | Location: Montreal | Registered: 07 November 2002Reply With Quote
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Yeah that's kind of crazy the first two keyholed and the others didn't. Would be interesting of you had a chronograph and chronographed them to see if the two that keyholed had a different velocity. We know what can cause a keyhole (basically an unstablized bullet) are too slow of a twist, too low of a velocity, too small of a diameter bullet for examples. Here's another thing too. Different rifles, twists, calibers, can change the distance a bullet goes to sleep (that is finally gets stabilized). I'd like to see what your reloads do at 100yards/meters. Is that possible for you? Another thing that will affect stabilization is a badly unbalanced bullet.
 
Posts: 662 | Registered: 15 May 2018Reply With Quote
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Remember the 458 wm has stopped shooting jacketed bullets along time ago and then stopped shooting .460 cast bullets-it keyholes all of them.It is now not keyholing unsized .465 powder coated bullets aside from the first two.
 
Posts: 11651 | Location: Montreal | Registered: 07 November 2002Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
Remember the 458 wm has stopped shooting jacketed bullets along time ago and then stopped shooting .460 cast bullets-it keyholes all of them.It is now not keyholing unsized .465 powder coated bullets aside from the first two.


We've talked so much and I hate to go back through many posts. What did you get when you slugged the bore on that 458 WM? How many rounds of jacketed do you think you have fired through it? I can't imagine anyone shooting out the barrel on a 458WM, that's more likely to happen on a 264WM or 220 Swift.

From you just stating it shoots the unsized cast better suggests the bore and groove is large o the rifling is very shallow.
 
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Yes the bore is large and the lands are shallow.This is causing the keyholes,IMO.It could have required a couple of rounds to heat things up.
 
Posts: 11651 | Location: Montreal | Registered: 07 November 2002Reply With Quote
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quote:
Originally posted by shootaway:
Yes the bore is large and the lands are shallow.This is causing the keyholes,IMO.It could have required a couple of rounds to heat things up.


Okay I have a similar problem with a Ruger American Ranch in 450 Bushmaster. It shoots jacketed fantastic. Cast is another thing. I tried all the different 45 caliber bullets I have molds for with no good results. Although it doesn't keyhole the accuracy is terrible unless I drop the velocity low, to the degree that I can equal it easy with a 45 Colt revolver or lever action. I tried a new bullet from a friend that designs molds and he said it will shoot his and it did! By the way the 450BM groove is .451 to .452 not .458 like a rifle although it is a rifle and not a revolver cartridge. That bullet out of a harder alloy did the trick. Soooooo maybe you could cast from a harder alloy and see if that makes a difference.
 
Posts: 662 | Registered: 15 May 2018Reply With Quote
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There is someone at the range who has some linotype that he wants to do away with and offered to sell.I might buy some and hive it a try.I too would like to try some more shooting at 100yds and see if I can come up with something more accurate.
 
Posts: 11651 | Location: Montreal | Registered: 07 November 2002Reply With Quote
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You can also blend that Linotype with what you are using. Linotype straight has a habit of giving an antimony wash on your bore...it makes it grey instead of dark carbon fouled. Also if you shoot Lino at high velocity it'll wear your throat kind of like jacketed. Like said blend it. I'll did you up a site for alloys.
 
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shootaway you may enjoy this site if you haven't already been there.

http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Contents.htm
 
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